Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Slide toppers on new 310GK not draining/shedding water

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Originally posted by howson View Post

    Paul and Liz,
    Welcome to Grand Design's Technical Forum!

    You're not the first to complain about water pooling on a topper. I'm expecting weather to roll through my area so I put in my slides. This is the angle of my toppers with the slides in. I'd be very curious to see what yours (and others) look like with the slide(s) in as a comparison. (I realize the size of the slide makes a difference, but it will be interesting nonetheless.)

    Side note--consider filling out your signature line: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/gdrv4li...-to-your-posts

    Click image for larger version Name:	Toppers.JPG Views:	0 Size:	133.7 KB ID:	16365
    Our toppers are almost flat and yours definitely have a steeper rake and shouldn't collect as much water as ours do.
    As a completely unscientific survey, I walked around the RV Park after a good rain and found that every rig with toppers had water pooled on them to greater or lessor extent so I guess I'll just live with it.

    Comment


    • #17
      We had the same issue on our last 5th wheel we bought(new) and the toppers where installed from the dealer. When we went to trade in we had mentioned about the toppers collecting water just like your unit. Come to find out they were not installed correctly. The top of the rail (if that's what you call it) was not installed at the proper angle to let the water drain properly. They did install the toppers on our new unit free of charge (labor)....Hope this helps
      2020 SOLITUDE 310GK
      2016 GMC DURAMAX 6.6 TURBO

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by kishman74 View Post
        We had the same issue on our last 5th wheel we bought(new) and the toppers where installed from the dealer. When we went to trade in we had mentioned about the toppers collecting water just like your unit. Come to find out they were not installed correctly. The top of the rail (if that's what you call it) was not installed at the proper angle to let the water drain properly. They did install the toppers on our new unit free of charge (labor)....Hope this helps
        Another first post providing a helpful input--fantastic! Welcome to Grand Design's Technical Forum, kishman74.

        Hope you'll continue to contribute and if so, consider filling out your signature line (see mine below as an example): https://gdrvowners.com/forum/gdrv4li...-to-your-posts

        -Howard
        Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

        2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus

        Comment


        • #19
          In many cases when the topper is installed just under the gutter there still isn't enough hight difference between the topper and the slide for proper drainage. Nothing can be done about that.
          Charles and Susan
          2021 Ram 3500 6.4 Hemi, 4x4 CCSB
          Andersen Hitch
          2021 Reflection 337rls

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by howson View Post

            Paul and Liz,
            Welcome to Grand Design's Technical Forum!

            You're not the first to complain about water pooling on a topper. I'm expecting weather to roll through my area so I put in my slides. This is the angle of my toppers with the slides in. I'd be very curious to see what yours (and others) look like with the slide(s) in as a comparison. (I realize the size of the slide makes a difference, but it will be interesting nonetheless.)

            Side note--consider filling out your signature line: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/gdrv4li...-to-your-posts

            Click image for larger version Name:	Toppers.JPG Views:	0 Size:	133.7 KB ID:	16365
            Howard, with the angle on your toppers, they definitely look like they would shed water without any pooling. Question I have is how do they do traveling? They look like they have a significant gap that may catch the wind when cruising down the highway. I'm going back and forth as to whether to get or not. If you're pulling the slides in due to whether, are you staying in the TT? How would you move around if so?
            Bob P.
            2018 F-350 CCLB 4X4 Dually
            2020 337RLS
            VIN last 8 L3326309

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Bob P View Post

              Howard, with the angle on your toppers, they definitely look like they would shed water without any pooling. Question I have is how do they do traveling? They look like they have a significant gap that may catch the wind when cruising down the highway. I'm going back and forth as to whether to get or not. If you're pulling the slides in due to whether, are you staying in the TT? How would you move around if so?
              Bob,
              Second question first: we're not full-timers. This is a picture of the camper in my back yard. I'm fortunate that the community HOA allows it. Also makes it easy to run out back and check things when forum members have a question.

              For towing, the toppers are completely unaffected. No flapping or movement of any kind. None! I'm super-pleased with how they travel.

              The toppers are installed per the installation instructions from Lippert. I don't understand why dealers, or apparently even GD at the factory, doesn't follow Lippert's installation guidance.

              If you haven't seen it yet, here's my install thread with a lot more information: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/exterio...all-19-315rlts

              -Howard
              Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

              2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by howson View Post
                I don't understand why dealers, or apparently even GD at the factory, doesn't follow Lippert's installation guidance.
                Hi Howard,

                I have been studying various pictures of topper installations and going back through your installation details. As I read about how you inverted and positioned the rails that mount to the wall . . . it occurred to me . . . hey! the drip rails were already on my Reflection 5th wheel from the factory! Looking at other 5th wheels, this seems to always be the case fro 5ths, but not so for TTs.

                To raise or invert the the wall attachments would mean removing or covering over the existing drip rails. Since mine were dealer installed . . . they were not about to do that. Toward the front or rear of a Reflection, where the roof slopes down significantly in both directions, there is only an inch or so to be gained by doing all that work. See the picture of the forward end of the bedroom closet slide on my 303.

                A curious difference (with/without OE drip rails) between 5th wheels and travel trailers.

                Rob
                Attached Files
                Cate & Rob
                (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
                2015 Reflection 303RLS
                2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post

                  Hi Howard,

                  I have been studying various pictures of topper installations and going back through your installation details. As I read about how you inverted and positioned the rails that mount to the wall . . . it occurred to me . . . hey! the drip rails were already on my Reflection 5th wheel from the factory! Looking at other 5th wheels, this seems to always be the case fro 5ths, but not so for TTs.

                  To raise or invert the the wall attachments would mean removing or covering over the existing drip rails. Since mine were dealer installed . . . they were not about to do that. Toward the front or rear of a Reflection, where the roof slopes down significantly in both directions, there is only an inch or so to be gained by doing all that work. See the picture of the forward end of the bedroom closet slide on my 303.

                  A curious difference (with/without OE drip rails) between 5th wheels and travel trailers.

                  Rob
                  That is interesting and something I did not know! I had to go look at a random walkthrough video to see what you meant (small red arrow is pointing to the rail).

                  Click image for larger version

Name:	Rail.JPG
Views:	729
Size:	125.4 KB
ID:	16504

                  That rail location *may* be just fine if the access plate hardware on the slide was positioned in the corner intersection instead of on the flange as seems to be the case in a lot of dealer installations (like yours). (The hardware on my Solera is a little different from other models but the installation instructions are still the same.)

                  Click image for larger version

Name:	access plate.JPG
Views:	448
Size:	108.9 KB
ID:	16505

                  This is your topper (from a pic you posted on my install thread) showing the difference in the installation. (I know you know this--posting it for everyone else reading this thread!)


                  Click image for larger version

Name:	robs.JPG
Views:	454
Size:	29.9 KB
ID:	16506

                  That difference alone could account for the pooling of water on the topper. If the access plates were lower (installed in the corner intersection where the flanges meet) the water would have a much greater chance of running off. There was nothing stopping your dealer from installing them lower, was there? (I'm not sure if your early 303 has EGS backer plates in the slide corners like I know my '19 315RLTS does.)

                  Recommending the factory install those rails as high as possible (if the clearance is limited) should be considered. GDRV-Megan--might be worth having the factory look at this feedback. Moving the drip rail higher isn't going to induce any cost but may result in a more satisfied owner that installs toppers. This thread has all the pertinent details.

                  -Howard
                  Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

                  2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    howson
                    Hi Howard,

                    Since we started this discussion (when you were installing your toppers) I have wondered why my dealer chose to install the drum brackets on the slide as high as they did. There is far more clearance between topper roll and slide flange than needed. The question of EGS in these corners is the unknown that I will have to work on before contemplating moving these brackets down.

                    I would suspect that there is no EGS in these corners. Later 303s have a second awning attached to the slide and when I asked about being able to add one of these awnings to my earlier 303, I was told that there were structural (EGS?) changes made to allow attachment of the second awning. A later Reflection with an awning attached to the slide would have no alternative other than to attach the topper brackets in the higher location on the slide flange. (See attached picture of a 2020)

                    Rob
                    Attached Files
                    Cate & Rob
                    (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
                    2015 Reflection 303RLS
                    2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                    Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Review of the construction drawings for my vintage of Reflection 303RLS shows no EGS or other backing in the corners of the slides below the flanges. So, my choice is to leave the attachments to the flanges where the dealer put them and where they have been secure for years, or move to a surface that might quite likely not be strong enough to get more slope to the topper. They will stay where they are.

                      howson A question for Howard . . .
                      From your installation experience, would it be possible to rotate the hex shafts to bring the drum lower while leaving the attachment plates where they are?

                      Rob
                      Cate & Rob
                      (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
                      2015 Reflection 303RLS
                      2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                      Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post
                        From your installation experience, would it be possible to rotate the hex shafts to bring the drum lower while leaving the attachment plates where they are?
                        Interesting possibility, Rob.

                        The extension rod is attached to the access plate by two self-tapping screws. If the access plate was turned 180 degrees, the extension rod would be very close to the height recommended by Lippert. Flipping the parts in my head (dangerous, trust me) I *think* the old holes in the extension rod will not line up with the access plate--but that's fine. Two new self-tapping screws and I expect it will install again. However, remember that the self-tapping bolt into the extension rod is the one where I snapped off the head because it is definitely not "Grade 8" material. Expect the head to give before the old bolt backs out when removing since they've been installed for so long.

                        For the access plate itself, mine has five attachment points, three holes on the top and two on the bottom. Flipping the plate would also mean attaching to new holes in the flange of the camper. Not much concern here as I'm sure you'd figure out how to fill the old ones with a strong material and attach new hardware securely. I am not positive how many screw attachments there are in your version of the access plate.

                        Forgive the obvious, but I'd check to ensure there's enough clearance between the fabric and slide with the extension rod in the lower position before actually attempting. You'll have to gauge the new angle vs the clearance available. (I expect there's a sizeable gap right now.)

                        Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

                        2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          howson
                          Hi Howard,

                          Flipping the brackets is an interesting idea that I had not thought of. A quick look seems to indicate that this would be too much drop of the topper drum. It looks like the hex shaft attachment to the bracket is designed for several adjustment steps . . . although no one seems to do this. I will get into these ideas further when the weather improves. We are enduring a really cold April this year.

                          Rob
                          Cate & Rob
                          (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
                          2015 Reflection 303RLS
                          2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                          Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by howson View Post

                            Interesting possibility, Rob.

                            The extension rod is attached to the access plate by two self-tapping screws. If the access plate was turned 180 degrees, the extension rod would be very close to the height recommended by Lippert.

                            Howard and Rob,
                            Interesting. Especially turning the topper brackets 180 degree’s. I know with the slide awning on my 303, I don’t believe there would be enough room to do that. I will be looking at this tomorrow.
                            Since the toppers have a 6 sided extension rods on each end of the mounting brackets, could you just move the awning outward by turning the rod one flat rotation outward, that could/would/ or might give some relief on the angle for draining?
                            Doing this would make more “gap” from the awning roll to the coach. Would this cause an issue with road travel with the wind at highway speeds?

                            I have been trying to figure this out also, since Howard did his 315. But on the 303, moving the patio awning down for the topper brackets to mount where they should be, would put the patio awning roll into/onto the top of the large window on the 303. I also wonder if this is why on the 303 at least, they mounted the patio awning at its current location, bottoms of the flange.
                            Steve
                            2018 Reflection 303
                            2023 F350 Lariat, 4 x 4 CCSB.
                            Diesel, Star White.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Superduty View Post


                              Howard and Rob,
                              Interesting. Especially turning the topper brackets 180 degree’s. I know with the slide awning on my 303, I don’t believe there would be enough room to do that. I will be looking at this tomorrow.
                              Since the toppers have a 6 sided extension rods on each end of the mounting brackets, could you just move the awning outward by turning the rod one flat rotation outward, that could/would/ or might give some relief on the angle for draining?
                              Doing this would make more “gap” from the awning roll to the coach. Would this cause an issue with road travel with the wind at highway speeds?

                              I have been trying to figure this out also, since Howard did his 315. But on the 303, moving the patio awning down for the topper brackets to mount where they should be, would put the patio awning roll into/onto the top of the large window on the 303. I also wonder if this is why on the 303 at least, they mounted the patio awning at its current location, bottoms of the flange.

                              Sent you a PM.
                              Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

                              2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by howson View Post


                                Sent you a PM.
                                Reply sent by PM

                                Steve
                                2018 Reflection 303
                                2023 F350 Lariat, 4 x 4 CCSB.
                                Diesel, Star White.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X