How much weight can front carry?

[TucsonJim]

I have a 2021 381m that is too light on the pin. I am planning on adding weights (like bags of sand) to the front compartment. On top of the generator housing would be a good/convenient place to place a few. On othe other hand I wouldn't want it bending the metal. Is there a max amount that I should put on there? I attached picture for reference.

Interesting thread Timelinex. I'm curious if you have weights for your overall trailer and your pin weight? Why do you think it's too light? Another point to consider.. If you add 400-600 pounds of pin weight, will it cause your tow vehicle to exceed it's rear axle weight rating, payload rating, or gross vehicle weight rating?

Jim

Jim

[timelinex]

Interesting thread Timelinex. I'm curious if you have weights for your overall trailer and your pin weight? Why do you think it's too light? Another point to consider.. If you add 400-600 pounds of pin weight, will it cause your tow vehicle to exceed it's rear axle weight rating, payload rating, or gross vehicle weight rating?

Jim

Jim

19k trailer, 2,660 pin. With a ~14% pin weight, I have no doubt in my mind it is too light!

This includes everything everywhere except the family in the car. With those weights I have 1k left of tow capacity and 1,120# of payload. My family is <400#, so that leaves us with 700# of more payload to work with.

[TucsonJim]

19k trailer, 2,660 pin. With a ~14% pin weight, I have no doubt in my mind it is too light!

This includes everything everywhere except the family in the car. With those weights I have 1k left of tow capacity and 1,120# of payload. My family is <400#, so that leaves us with 700# of more payload to work with.

Awesome job! Happy trails.

Jim

[Cate&Rob]

19k trailer, 2,660 pin. With a ~14% pin weight, I have no doubt in my mind it is too light!

Are you experiencing sway or similar when towing that tells you your pin weight is too light?
I know that the "history" of 5th wheel trailers is that pin weight should be 20% or more . . . but I have never seen any test data to substantiate this.

There is test data that shows that a trailer becomes unstable with less than 10% of total trailer weight on the hitch.
Truck manufacturers typically calculate maximum gooseneck trailer weight using a 15% pin weight.
Several 5th wheel RV manufacturers (including Grand Design) are pushing the pin weights of their smaller 5th wheels below 20% to make them "half ton towable".

I don't think a trailer knows whether it is being pulled by an attachment point at the bumper or over the axle of the tow vehicle . . . which would indicate that greater than 10% of trailer weight on the hitch/pin should result in a stable tow.

I would be interested in any data or experience that demonstrates that a 5th wheel trailer needs more weight on the tow point than a bumper pull trailer, to remain stable.

Rob

[timelinex]

Are you experiencing sway or similar when towing that tells you your pin weight is too light?
I know that the "history" of 5th wheel trailers is that pin weight should be 20% or more . . . but I have never seen any test data to substantiate this.

There is test data that shows that a trailer becomes unstable with less than 10% of total trailer weight on the hitch.
Truck manufacturers typically calculate maximum gooseneck trailer weight using a 15% pin weight.
Several 5th wheel RV manufacturers (including Grand Design) are pushing the pin weights of their smaller 5th wheels below 20% to make them "half ton towable".

I don't think a trailer knows whether it is being pulled by an attachment point at the bumper or over the axle of the tow vehicle . . . which would indicate that greater than 10% of trailer weight on the hitch/pin should result in a stable tow.

I would be interested in any data or experience that demonstrates that a 5th wheel trailer needs more weight on the tow point than a bumper pull trailer, to remain stable.

Rob

I am not experienced with trailering/RV dialect enough to give you an exact word that describes it. It just feels a bit floaty and like things very easily disrupt the balance of the system. I'm not feeling actual unprovoked sway the entire time or anything like that. Besides external forces (like a semi passing) it also feels like any action I take gets very exaggerated too. I can compare this to towing a 10k trailer with my tundra, which maxed out my GVWR. I would feel sway when a semi passed and I would feel repercussions from big bumps. HOWEVER, other than that felt like a freight train and even if I DID go to 75-80 (which I avoided), it felt solid. So maybe the best way to describe it is that I felt like (maybe correctly or incorrectly) I had to be hyper aware the entire time versus a normal amount of awareness during towing.

I had to apply the trailer brakes manually twice during my 3hr round trip. Once after a semi passed at a high speed and the second time was when I drifted in the lane just a bit and corrected. Correcting back introduced some uneasy sway. Again, I don't have enough experience to tell you if it was actually needed, but I felt the rear end step out of line a little and start to oscillate so I reacted immediately to that to nip it in the but.

[Country Campers]

timelinex

What you are describing is called "the tail wagging the dog" and yes that is a technical term (LOL). You are feeling sway in the worse case, caused by wind or any other movement other than driving straight down the road. You will for sure need more tongue weight and maybe even less weight in the trailer. I wonder if you can take a trip without the SXS in the back to get a feel for the ride and see if it is any different. Then from there you can make adjustments when loading. I realize these are built to haul toys but the manufactures sometimes do not think beyond the drawing board so you may have to get creative.

I had a TT one time that did the same thing, traveled down the road pretty nicely until a semi passed us, we were doing about 60 he was doing about 80. The semi pulled us out to the dotted line when he got beside me, when he passed the wind shoved me towards the guard rail. I had my hand on the trailer brake slider the whole time as I learned from my dad to not use the truck brakes in this situation, things will get worse if you do. After that ride, it was 1/2 ton truck, we graduated to a 3/4 ton truck and all was well, we had too much trailer for the 1/2 ton truck.

I think you will get a handle on this it will just take a little experimenting.

Brian

[Jlawles2]

I do not own a toy hauler, but from what i have been reading, it appears that the GD designers may have missed the weight mark a little on the garage (probably other mfg also but we don't hear about them here). Would be nice if when stating garage capacity, they gave a location for the weight of the cargo.