Bent rear jack on a ground control 3.0 system on a Reflection 303RLS

[tgodrich]

Wondering if anyone has had experience with attempting to repair a bent jack mount.
Yesterday, when backing in my RV, the left rear jack snagged the curb and the result was a bent jack. The jack is pushed forward about 1", sort of rotated forward. The jack was retracted when this happened, and it still works.

I am wondering if anyone has attempted to repair this. No welds are cracked and the mount to the trailer is not bent. Just the metal from the bracket to the jack.
I was thinking of trying to bend it back to straight down. To do this, I would hook my heavy duty tow chain to the base of the jack, and secure the chain to a large rock or other immovable object. Then put the truck in drive and slowly pull the chain taught, and then apply a slight pull to see if this will bend it back.
The alternate to this is to replace the jack, which is expensive. So I am likely going to attempt the fix anyway.
I will post the results when I eventually pull the trailer out again.

I have not liked the low placement to the ground of these rear jacks. I take the RV to off road areas and they get quite close to the ground at times. Poor design on Grand Design's part IMHO. A rotating feature would be a good improvement.

I am also planning on changing from 15" wheels to 16' wheels to gain some height of the trailer. My new 2020 chevy 3500 is taller and now the nose of the trailer is a bit higher than I would like, which makes the rear jack clearance situation even worse. I was waiting until i wore out the stock 15" tires before converting. In hindsight, perhaps I should have done it now. Might have avoided the bent jack.

Any experiences with bent jack repair out there? I found one You Tube, but that jack was bent inward sideways, not forward like mine.

[TucsonJim]

Dang Tony - Sorry to hear that.

I'd be careful with trying to pull it back straight. I'd be concerned that you could possibly tweak the frame which could cause a lot of issues.

If you want to get some additional height, I'd consider raising the whole frame. Several years ago, Cate&Rob told me about a company called trailerblocks.com. They make blocks that go between the spring mounts. I installed 1-1/2" blocks on my rig and it gave me more clearance when I'm going off the beaten path. They have blocks all the way up to 3". They are a little pricey, but the prices are in Canadian dollars, so when you make the purchase, the exchange rate it taken into account. If you do purchase from them, I'd also purchase their U-bolts, but I'd stay with the OEM tie plates which are stronger than the ones that come in the kit.

Here's a link:
https://www.trailerblocks.com/

Here's my install photo.

[Cate&Rob]

tgodrich
Hi Tony,

You are not the first to wonder about the low placement of the levelling system jacks. They are technically above the "approach angle" from tire to end of body . . . but, things like curbs do not stay out of that smooth road approach angle.

I would be with TucsonJim on the risks of trying to bend it back. Steel "work hardens" when it is bent, so it takes more force to bend something back than it does to bend it in the first place. The risk is twisting your frame rail as Jim points out. I would suggest going with a large trailer repair facility and following their recommendation on either bending back or cutting off and replacing. If they decide to bend it back, they would have the means to stabilize the frame rail so that it does not twist.

A word of caution on the spacer blocks to gain ride height. I did find the supplier that Jim references and several owners have used these blocks successfully. As a collective of members on this forum (particularly Guest ) dug into suspension geometry of our trailers (particularly WRT breaking spring hangers) we realized that the additional leverage on the spring by the axle (created by the lift blocks) was definitely in the wrong direction for spring hanger durability.

The best way to gain ride height would be to have a spacer inserted between the frame rail and the spring hangers. Grand Design now does this in production for some models. Not an inexpensive modification, but done correctly is money well spent.

Rob

[Yoda]

Dang Tony - Sorry to hear that.

I'd be careful with trying to pull it back straight. I'd be concerned that you could possibly tweak the frame which could cause a lot of issues.

If you want to get some additional height, I'd consider raising the whole frame. Several years ago, Cate&Rob told me about a company called trailerblocks.com. They make blocks that go between the spring mounts. I installed 1-1/2" blocks on my rig and it gave me more clearance when I'm going off the beaten path. They have blocks all the way up to 3". They are a little pricey, but the prices are in Canadian dollars, so when you make the purchase, the exchange rate it taken into account. If you do purchase from them, I'd also purchase their U-bolts, but I'd stay with the OEM tie plates which are stronger than the ones that come in the kit.

Here's a link:
https://www.trailerblocks.com/

Here's my install photo.

Jim - did you get their kit with the U bolts, or source your U-bolts locally? Also how do you measure U bolt length needed. The ones they include in the kit are 9/16 grade 8. Is that what Dexter used stock? I guess I can crawl under and measure. Is the anodizing worth it?

Thanks for any help.

[TucsonJim]

Keith - Your questions are causing a flicker in my memory bank...

I originally purchased the complete kit with tie plates and U-bolts. But the tie plates deformed at the proper torque levels, and the U-bolts rusted. So when I had to change an axle, I also replaced all four tie plates and U-bolts. I used the Lippert tie plates which were much more robust. For the life of me, I can't remember where I purchased the U-bolts. All the U-bolts I purchased were too long and I couldn't find the perfect fit. So I installed the longer ones and cut them to length with an angle grinder after installation.

If I was doing it all over, I'd just purchase the lift blocks from this company, use the OEM tie plates, and purchase U-bolts from another source. I my memory reboots, I'll come back and list where I purchased mine.

Jim

[Yoda]

Keith - Your questions are causing a flicker in my memory bank...

I originally purchased the complete kit with tie plates and U-bolts. But the tie plates deformed at the proper torque levels, and the U-bolts rusted. So when I had to change an axle, I also replaced all four tie plates and U-bolts. I used the Lippert tie plates which were much more robust. For the life of me, I can't remember where I purchased the U-bolts. All the U-bolts I purchased were too long and I couldn't find the perfect fit. So I installed the longer ones and cut them to length with an angle grinder after installation.

If I was doing it all over, I'd just purchase the lift blocks from this company, use the OEM tie plates, and purchase U-bolts from another source. I my memory reboots, I'll come back and list where I purchased mine.

Jim

Thanks Jim

[tgodrich]

Thanks for the feedback. The bend I have is not on the bracket that holds the jack to the frame. I will try to get a picture. The jack is held to the bracket by what appears to be either a block of steel or two plates welded. It is this block or plates that is bent. The bracket does not appear affected at all. It was a low speed bump (1-2 mph max) of the foot on the jack that bent the jack. As I said, the jack still works, so the tube of the jack is intact, just moved.

As a secondary question, (and maybe discussed somewhere else in the forum), I note the images of the blocks to raise the trailer. I think 1.5' would be safe, but 3' seems a bit much . Has anyone tried spring mount extensions? We used these on muscle cars in days gone by to raise the rear of cars. They simply amount to a longer plate of steel from the frame to the spring mount.

The larger 16" wheels will solve some of the height problem.

[tgodrich]

Another question... How do I tell the size of my axles? The link I went to for the trailer blocks sells the kits based on axle size rating

[TucsonJim]

Another question... How do I tell the size of my axles? The link I went to for the trailer blocks sells the kits based on axle size rating

There should be a placard on the axle itself with the weight rating. In addition, if you look at the placard on the drivers side with the VIN number, there should be a tag that says the GAWR. GAWR stands for Gross Axle Weight Rating, and it will match your axle size.

Jim

[tgodrich]

There should be a placard on the axle itself with the weight rating. In addition, if you look at the placard on the drivers side with the VIN number, there should be a tag that says the GAWR. GAWR stands for Gross Axle Weight Rating, and it will match your axle size.

Jim

Thanks Jim!

[Lonestar]

T
As a secondary question, (and maybe discussed somewhere else in the forum), I note the images of the blocks to raise the trailer. I think 1.5' would be safe, but 3' seems a bit much . Has anyone tried spring mount extensions? We used these on muscle cars in days gone by to raise the rear of cars. They simply amount to a longer plate of steel from the frame to the spring mount.

The larger 16" wheels will solve some of the height problem.

I'm not certain about the spring extensions, but on my 150 Series the hangers are marginal at best. I know there have been issues with hanger weld cracks and separation. Any modification without strengthening hangers sounds like a potential problem.

I too have wondered about using blocks not taller than 1.5". But again, this is going to put stress on already weak hangers. As mentioned above, the most effective way is to put a spacer above the hangers.

On my previous trailer I had a 2" tube welded to the frame. Then the spring hangers were welded to that and also re-enforced. Additional 2" tubing was welded to each hanger and attached to the hanger on the opposite side of the trailer. Lippert did the work, they stated otherwise the frame warranty would be voided.

[Cate&Rob]

I'm not certain about the spring extensions, but on my 150 Series the hangers are marginal at best. I know there have been issues with hanger weld cracks and separation. Any modification without strengthening hangers sounds like a potential problem.

I would agree with your premise that increasing ride height without reinforcing the spring hangers is not a good idea. Just as a point of clarification, the hanger failures are not weld cracks or separation. The hangers fail by way of fatigue breaks in the heat affected zones beside the welds. The top section of the hanger is always still firmly attached to the structure above and the welds are intact, after the legs of the hanger have broken off.

Rob

[Guest]

Agree a new channel between the spring hangers and frame would be optimum. Blocks are ok if they are not too tall. Personally, I wanted to stay at 1 inch. Another approach would be to add in the blocks and weld in the V clips on the rear hangers. This would provide a strong solution to rear axle hanger failures and would be a much cheaper solution in raising the rig.

Rob and I and others have discussed the weakness in these Ben Hur suspensions and have found the inherent issue with these suspension types is front axle rise on heavy braking which puts most all the stopping forces on the rear hangers. Its best to avoid heavy braking if at all possible, so not good to do panic stops for a brake test where the system (especially rear hangers) are being stressed for no valid reason.

I made up my own blocks at a buddies machine shop where solid steel blocks were used and drilled straight through and integrated to the springs with longer center bolts. This is a cheap and effective solution. U bolts can be purchased at any local spring shop. For anyone doing this be sure to peen over the bolt threads on the center bolt after clamping the spring pack and tightening the center bolt nut. This will ensure it never comes loose.

Jim

[Lonestar]

I would agree with your premise that increasing ride height without reinforcing the spring hangers is not a good idea. Just as a point of clarification, the hanger failures are not weld cracks or separation. The hangers fail by way of fatigue breaks in the heat affected zones beside the welds. The top section of the hanger is always still firmly attached to the structure above and the welds are intact, after the legs of the hanger have broken off.

Rob

OK, thanks for the clarification. I misunderstood.

Has Lippert offered any after market suspension improvements by their techs at GD rallies? I other words, can one pay to have Lippert beef up suspension parts?

[Cate&Rob]

Lonestar

I can't speak for LCI or their technicians, but I do know several of them and they would be very reluctant to do anything more than emergency repairs at a Rally. Something about not wanting to lay in wet grass while welding . . . LOL! They will do almost any modification at one of their service facilities in the Elkhart area or at the Grand Design Factory Service Center in Goshen. Working on a level dry concrete floor is going to result in a better job anyway. This work has to be scheduled ahead of time with one of these facilities and service appointments around National Rally time usually book up a year in advance. I am not sure what you had in mind as "aftermarket" improvements but they will add "similar to production" improvements such as a spacer between the frame and hangers and V-clip reinforcements in the hangers. I don't know where you are located, but there are also any number of heavy trailer fabrication/repair businesses that can do this same type of work.

Rob