Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Electrical outlet troubles in bathroom and bedroom in 2022 Momentum 25G

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Electrical outlet troubles in bathroom and bedroom in 2022 Momentum 25G

    From what I’ve seen owning a GD for quality RV’s i’am not impressed at all! We took ownership of this trailer in November of 2021 because prices were starting to go up rapidly. We ordered in the fall and came within a couple months, a month earlier than expected. We never used until August of 2022 for the first time and got along good with it. We did find a couple small things and had them fixed before warranty ran out, at least one thing got fixed the others was the Wingard TV antenna which still sucks unless your real close to a tv tower.
    Now on this second trip just a week ago the power went off to the tv and all outlets in bathroom and bedroom and outside in front of camper. There’s two GFCI outlets, one behind the TV and other is in bathroom. I tested and replaced outlet behind tv and it that worked. The bathroom is a different story no electricity at all to any of the wires behind the outlet. No electricity to any of the outlets on the wires behind the outlets. I can’t get any answers from GD from which breaker runs all these outlets to start from. All the breakers have electricity, i checked each one. Has anyone had any problems like this? All these crimp type outlets suck and i could replace them all but maybe won’t solve the problem. There has to be a problem at some point and all GD says is you have to have a multi circuit tester. I have a two different testers just that show theres electricity or not which i think should be enough.
    so when i get back home i can hear something running when cleaning out the camper and it sounds like the water pump but it’s turned off, the switch does nothing so i had to to turn off battery power at the main switch in the water hookup area. So something is whacked up on that also now. The workmanship on what I’ve seen so far has gotten me to realize that maybe GD is not as good constructed as led one to believe. I have a picture of the receptacle in the bathroom, the hole for the electrical box is way to big so the clamps to mount into the wall have nothing to grab unto, the on corner is broken off so they used a black Sheetrock screw to hold it and placed the cover on to cover it up. We thought it felt kind of loose when we plugged into it once and this is why. Frustrated right now i tell ya!

  • #2
    Hi Randall,

    Welcome to our owners technical forum. Please see our "welcome" info for populating your signature and navigating the forum https://gdrvowners.com/forum/main-fo...welcome-letter

    Your issue is not uncommon (not that this helps at the moment) If you search the forum for related threads, you may get some ideas. Unfortunately, the entire towable RV industry builds with the components and methods that you have observed in your trailer. We all work through these things on a regular basis.

    Grand Design does not have wiring diagrams. RVs are wired more like a house than a vehicle. The build info defines where outlets are to be placed, but not how the wiring is to be run from one to the next. It sounds like you are looking for a disconnected wire, most likely in a box. Another likely source is the Molex brand connectors used to transition from the solid house wiring to the flexible wire which connects to a slide and then back to the solid wiring.

    The thing that you hear running (that sounds like a water pump) is likely the cooling fan on the converter (battery charger).

    Rob

    Cate & Rob
    (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
    2015 Reflection 303RLS
    2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
    Bayham, Ontario, Canada

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks for the information. So at what point should a person start? Tear everything out and put new in? All the boxes I’ve pulled have these cheap press in like one would see on a string of outside underground wiring press into cord typ connections. What would these MOLEX connectors look like? I have a 2022 25G, where would the inverter be located? I have solar and thats in the storage compartment. There is a running noise and it sounds like its behind the breaker and fuse box area. The other sound i was referring to is coming from the kitchen bathroom area under something.

      Comment


      • #4
        Randall kjose, well does it sound like a very loud computer fan? If the solar charger, inverter or converter is running hot, the fan will come on and it is loud. if this is the noise, I would look for those components first. By the way, usually the converter is right behind the panel or at least very close.... so it could be that.
        We live to serve our two Golder Retrievers
        2022 Reflection 303RLS
        2016 GMC Denali 3500

        Comment


        • #5
          If you have power coming out of the breaker panel, it is a bit of a guess as to which outlet is closest and likely to be the first one in the string. All you can do is pull the outlets, pop off the back cover and look to see if the wires coming in and going out are properly inserted into the knife connectors. No one will argue that these outlets are "less than ideal" but they are approved by RVIA and are the industry standard because they are fast to install in production. If you find the problem outlet, it is usually (if there is enough wire) possible to replace with a residential style box and outlet.

          See this thread for discussion on the Molex connectors https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...lex-connectors.

          The inverter is often directly behind (o sometimes part of) the breaker box. The other cooling fan that might be running on its own could be the fridge.

          Rob
          Cate & Rob
          (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
          2015 Reflection 303RLS
          2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
          Bayham, Ontario, Canada

          Comment


          • #6
            Like Rob said. You are going to have to pull rec's one at a time and hopefully find a wire off. Time consuming but I don't think you have any other option.
            2018 Dodge 3500 6.7 Cummins w Aisin and 9 cup holders
            Not to brag or anything about my finances, but my bank calls me about every day to tell me my balance is OUTSTANDING!

            Comment


            • #7
              So the noise i was hearing running all the time was the water pump under the sink and finally had to unplug it because whatever i did nothing worked.

              Comment


              • #8
                I did hear the fan on the inverter and it’s behind the fuse panel. The plug ins i guess will have to be replaced one at a tike and hopefully it will take care of the problem. I have a snake camera i can cable in through the walls to see where things go i’am going to try.

                Comment


                • #9
                  There should be a switch for the inverter to turn it off when not needed. There is also a subpanel for the inverter power outlets, there are 3 outlets power by the inverter which may be the 3 that do not have power at the moment, check this before you start tearing things apart. I would check for a on/off switch for the inverter. I understand your frustration at the moment but I would think if you take a minute to understand what all is going on and how the systems works I think you will be able to get this figured out.

                  Brian
                  Brian & Michelle
                  2018 Reflection 29RS
                  2022 Chevy 3500HD

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The first picture you posted is the in wall slide controller. Nothing on it will control the water pump.

                    I'm going to guess the is a unity board somewhere that is controlling the water pump. I know there are a couple of water pump switches on your reflection and would not be surprised if the 25 is the same way. Usually they are state of change to the board to turn the pomp on or off. Meaning any switch should change the pump from on to off regardless of its initial position and state of the pump. You may find a switch somewhere that is getting bumped and causing the pump to run.
                    Joseph
                    Tow
                    Vehicle: 2024 GMC K3500 Denali Ultimate Diesel
                    Coach: 303RLS Delivered March 5, 2021
                    South of Houston Texas

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      When were talking switch for inverter your talking breaker switch? There is a fuse panel for DC and then the breaker switches all in the same site. There also is a another stell box with two breakers in it. I don’t know what has to be done to get to the inverter. I did know that the slide out box under the sink has nothing to do with water pump, just stating where and what things are under the sink. There is a main board that has all the switches for slide outs, awnings, water pump, water heater, main lights. I had that pulled out to look at water pump switch thought it might be bad but switching either way on it made no difference. It’s like current is getting to pump some other way, because disconnecting those switch wires did nothing.it kept running..

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Another question is when should the inverter be running and not, wasn’t told much about this and book doesn’t say much. What’s its purpose’?

                        Comment


                        • #13

                          Randall kjose I'm with Country Campers . If you have an inverter, you should have a subpanel that powers 3 or 4 outlets. There is a separate breaker for these outlets. You may want to check the breakers in your subpanel.

                          In our 2021 21G the suppanel is to the left of the main distribution panel (see picture below). It is behind a small door that you have to open. Note the outlets that are powered through this breaker. IF those are the outlets that are not working, you probably found a good place to start.

                          If the breaker is tripped, you probably know the problem. If it isn't, verify it is getting power (it should have power whether on shore power or inverter). Follow back to the actual inverter. You may have an inverter with a built-in ATS (automatic transfer switch), or you may have an ATS outside the inverter. A non-functioning ATS could be an issue as well.

                          Click image for larger version

Name:	Inverter Panel.jpg
Views:	342
Size:	137.1 KB
ID:	113338




                          As you have noted, your remote inverter switch is in the outside storage compartment. Below is a picture of how ours came from the factory. Because yours is a 2022 it is likely a little different.

                          Click image for larger version

Name:	Outside JPG.jpg
Views:	236
Size:	209.8 KB
ID:	113340



                          Below is a picture of where the inverter is located. There is an access panel in the outside storage. Remove 2 screws and you will see your inverter (and possibly your solar charge controller).


                          Click image for larger version

Name:	Wiring 3.jpg
Views:	223
Size:	113.8 KB
ID:	113339


                          I removed that entire panel to do some work and this is what I found. Note, the solar charge controller and inverter are not labeled. But this gives you an idea of how yours might be wired.


                          Click image for larger version

Name:	Inside JPG.jpg
Views:	241
Size:	91.1 KB
ID:	113341





                          As far as the sound behind your distribution panel, it could be a couple things. My guess is it's the fan from the converter (if it sounds like a fan), or loose wires in your ATS. If you have a generator, or generator prep, you will need a different ATS between shore power and generator power. The ATS could be located directly behind, or attached to (like mine) your main distribution panel.

                          I son;t have a picture of my distribution panel with the ATS, but did find this on the internet. Below is how ours was setup. The ATS was attached to the back of the distribution panel.


                          Click image for larger version

Name:	ATS.jpg
Views:	227
Size:	67.0 KB
ID:	113342



                          I hope this is helpful.

                          Allen

                          2021 Momentum 21G

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Randall kjose View Post
                            When were talking switch for inverter your talking breaker switch? There is a fuse panel for DC and then the breaker switches all in the same site. There also is a another stell box with two breakers in it. I don’t know what has to be done to get to the inverter. I did know that the slide out box under the sink has nothing to do with water pump, just stating where and what things are under the sink. There is a main board that has all the switches for slide outs, awnings, water pump, water heater, main lights. I had that pulled out to look at water pump switch thought it might be bad but switching either way on it made no difference. It’s like current is getting to pump some other way, because disconnecting those switch wires did nothing.it kept running..
                            OK, this will be long...sorry..

                            In your main distribution panel you will have a breaker for the inverter (in my previous post you should be able to see mine). This is, essentially, the AC out to the inverter. Your small box with 2 breakers are part of the inverter circuit.

                            This is how it works: When you are plugged into shore power (or the generator is running) that power will flow directly to your main distribution panel. The power will go to each breaker in your main distribution panel. This is how your trailer gets AC power.

                            Note you have a converter breaker in your main distribution panel. When AC power comes through the breaker to your converter, the converter will convert AC electricity to DC electricity. This DC electricity is sent to the DC side of your main distribution panel to power all DC components.

                            If you are not plugged into shore power (or do not have a generator powering your trailer) you will not get an AC power to your trailer. Therefore all AC component will not have an power. However, because your batteries provide DC power AND are connected to you main distribution panel, you will have power to your DC components until the battery is dead.

                            TO provide AC power when you do not have shore power or do not have a generator, you can have an inverter. An inverter will convert ("invert") DC electricity to AC electricity. The inverter will use your batteries DC electricity, convert to AC electricity and power AC components.

                            However....if your inverter cannot produce enough power to power the entire trailer, you have a problem. For example, Our trailer came with a 1000W inverter. That works great for anything that uses less than 1000W of power. But, you do have electrical components that use more than 1000W of power....microwave, air conditioner, electric kettle, coffee machine (some), haor dryer, etc.

                            When you have an inverter that cannot power all AC components, another method is used. only specific outlets are connected to the inverter. This is what Grand Designs has done.

                            TO do this, you install a subpanel for the outlets you want connected to the inverter. Connect those outlets to the breaker in the subpanel.

                            The inverter AC OUT is connected to this subpanel breaker. So, when the inverter is ON, the breaker in the subpanel is powered by the inverter....however, no AC power will be going to your MIAN distrbution panel...only the subpanel.

                            How do those outlets get power when the inverter is off or when you are plugged into shore power? That's where the ATS comes in. If you have a separate ATS it works like this:

                            The ATS will have an AC INPUT from shore power/generator (through the "inverter" breaker in your moan distribution panel), and another AC INPUT from the inverter (directly from the inverter). The ATS will also have an AC OUTPUT to the subpanel. The ATS will only allow one of the AC INPUTs to provide power. If it senses power from shore/generator power, it will block the inverter power from entering the ATS. The power will flow through the ATS to the OUTPUT which will power the subpanel (this is how your subpanel gets power when plugged into shore power).

                            If there is no shore power, the ATS will allow power from the inverter to the AC OUTPUT and into the subpanel. This is how the inverter powers the subpanel.

                            If your inverter has a built-in ATS, shore power/generator (the "inverter" breaker in the main distribution panel) will go directly to the AC INPUT of the inverter. The inverter's ATS will allow shore power/generator to flow through the inverter to the AC OUTPUT of the inverter into the subpanel. IF no power is coming from shore power/generator, the built0in ATS will allow power form the inverter to the AC OUTPUT into the subpanel.

                            Hope that all makes sense.

                            So, you would only use your inverter when you do not have shore power/generator, and want to power those outlets.

                            If you are plugged into shore power or are using a generator, there is no reason to use the inverter, so I would just turn it off.

                            Allen

                            2021 Momentum 21G

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Ok so i figured out the water pump is was the outside switch after you mentioned that and reading in the book I remembered that switch outside so thank you guy! Now for the outlets, i read what you sent and pictures look similar to my trailer but still can’t find the inverter. Breakers in that steel box were not tripped so have to be in the wiring because i can’t find any inverter switch. Any other suggestions. There’s like 6 outlets in front that have anything. The outside refrigerator has a plug in plus another inside and outside on that side of campers outdoor kitchen. A plug in in the water hookup area and and one along side the bed opposite side of water hookup. How would one go about testing. I have a two prong tester that lights up and shows current and a multi tester with different settings for amps, volts, etc. which i have no idea how to use.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X