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There has been quite a bit of discussion on various Facebook groups about scorching walls behind unvented microwave / convection ovens. I just pulled ours, and we indeed have scorched walls. I couldn't find a similar report in the Appliances section, so here goes!
Due to an accident, we had our driver side wall replaced in September (great support from GDRV service, especially Val). So this wall is only 5 months old!
Have any of you faced this? If so, what mitigations have you put in?
GDRV-EmilyGDRV-Megan Is it possible to retrofit an external vent in this unit? I remember hearing somewhere that there is an aluminum frame member where the vent would need to go, but I don't think it was authoritative. Does GDRV have any remedy "in hand" that you recommend to or perform for owners experiencing this problem?
Even if an external vent could be put in, it isn't clear to me that would fix the problem, as the hot spot is not near the vent exits, and venting is currently happening through the front top of the unit.
I'm currently considering putting an aluminum or steel heat shield back there, but to be effective that would need an air gap on both sides, and there is very little extra space behind the unit (below, you can see where the back came in contact with the seam tape).
It is interesting to me that the Furrion unit in a friend's rig has an extra metal strip screwed onto the bottom of the back with seemingly no purpose except to shim the unit away from the wall approximately 3/16 inch..
I'm considering shimming the mounting hardware to give me approximately 3/8" clearance behind, and putting a sheet of metal with ~3/16" on either side, and also allowing air to come in through gaps in the bottom shim to create a chimney effect. I'd dearly like some thoughts about this approach.
This much scorching in only 5 months! The loose 12V wire is now neatly strapped across the batten at the top back, out of the way. Close up of the scorching Note that the seam table has bubbled, and the glue is oozing out. The seam tape came in contact with the back of the unit. Residue from the seam tape on the back of the unit. I need to fix this somehow; still considering options. Some people have reported simply replacing the unit with another brand, but who is to say that wouldn't have a similar problem?
Yours is a good summary of the situation and you have provided great pictures. I know that Grand Design is aware of this concern, so I will wait for Megan or Emily to reply to your tags . . . Remember that this is a weekend . . . us retired guys tend to forget that part .
Yikes! That's scary. I wonder if GD has changed anything in the ensuing years? Thanks for sharing this Al.
Brian & Kellie
2020 Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, MORryde IS, 1,460w solar and 540ah BBGC3
2020 Ford F-350 Platinum SRW PSD Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch
Previous setups:
2019 Grand Design Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 Ford F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
2016 Grand Design Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch
Yikes! That's scary. I wonder if GD has changed anything in the ensuing years? Thanks for sharing this Al.
Brian--GD no longer installs HighPointe microwave ovens. lobsters (Al), following Rob's lead I will also wait for Megan and/or Emily's response.
Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
There are many threads about this topic, but I decided to not put this in the most recent, which is about the Customer Satisfaction program installing an insulating board behind the unit.
A while ago, our unit had stopped working completely and we ordered a Sharp to replace it. However it has been delayed several weeks so I decided to bring down the High Pointe and see if I could diagnose and repair it. We miss our microwave, but even more miss the convection oven which we use for almost every dinner. Neither my wife nor I are particularly strong and I was hesitant to try to do it ourselves—but with social distancing in place it is hard to say to a neighbor, "come on over!" Taking it out was easy-peasey. Pictures below.
It turned out to be the main power fuse. The fuse is the glass tube style, AGC-20 (20A). A quick trip to the local car parts store, and we're back in business. In one of the threads about the scorching the question was asked, "how hot does it get?" So while it was down I used my infrared temperature gun, and measured 235 degrees with the convection over set to 300 degrees. This is with the unit sitting on the counter subject to natural convective cooling, not up in its installed position with no air flow. I suspect without being able to prove it that it approaches oven temperature when installed.
To replace the fuse, one has to remove the black case. The silver rear panel and front control panel / door are not affected. The front vent piece above the door has tabs which fit into a channel in the cabinet we need to remove. Freeing that up was the hardest part of this repair; I had to use a screwdriver to separate the front piece from the cabinet putting it in the slot and twisting gently back and forth across the joint.
The fuse is on a small circuit board at the front of the unit. It is fairly obvious, but see the pictures below.
Here is how we got the unit down safely; it turned out to be very easy. We used cushions from the back of the sofa. They allowed it to be lowered just enough to disengage from the bracket on the wall.
Now to try to cancel the much-delayed Sharp!
Attached Files
Al and Kathe
:No longer full-time. New sticks and bricks in East Helena, MT
There are many threads about this topic, but I decided to not put this in the most recent, which is about the Customer Satisfaction program installing an insulating board behind the unit.
A while ago, our unit had stopped working completely and we ordered a Sharp to replace it. However it has been delayed several weeks so I decided to bring down the High Pointe and see if I could diagnose and repair it. We miss our microwave, but even more miss the convection oven which we use for almost every dinner. Neither my wife nor I are particularly strong and I was hesitant to try to do it ourselves—but with social distancing in place it is hard to say to a neighbor, "come on over!" Taking it out was easy-peasey. Pictures below.
It turned out to be the main power fuse. The fuse is the glass tube style, AGC-20 (20A). A quick trip to the local car parts store, and we're back in business. In one of the threads about the scorching the question was asked, "how hot does it get?" So while it was down I used my infrared temperature gun, and measured 235 degrees with the convection over set to 300 degrees. This is with the unit sitting on the counter subject to natural convective cooling, not up in its installed position with no air flow. I suspect without being able to prove it that it approaches oven temperature when installed.
To replace the fuse, one has to remove the black case. The silver rear panel and front control panel / door are not affected. The front vent piece above the door has tabs which fit into a channel in the cabinet we need to remove. Freeing that up was the hardest part of this repair; I had to use a screwdriver to separate the front piece from the cabinet putting it in the slot and twisting gently back and forth across the joint.
The fuse is on a small circuit board at the front of the unit. It is fairly obvious, but see the pictures below.
Here is how we got the unit down safely; it turned out to be very easy. We used cushions from the back of the sofa. They allowed it to be lowered just enough to disengage from the bracket on the wall.
Now to try to cancel the much-delayed Sharp!
Where does the High Pointe vent? The top of the High Pointe is "solid" while the top front of the Furrion has slots. I *assume* air is sucked from the bottom by the fans and exhausted out the top--but where? From your pictures the internals look almost identical to the Furrion.
Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
Where does the High Pointe vent? The top of the High Pointe is "solid" while the top front of the Furrion has slots. I *assume* air is sucked from the bottom by the fans and exhausted out the top--but where? From your pictures the internals look almost identical to the Furrion.
Hi, Howard. It vents out the front of the top. About the first inch back is slotted. This is in the plastic front piece above the door, not in the metal cabinet that I removed. See pic.
Al and Kathe
:No longer full-time. New sticks and bricks in East Helena, MT
What interesting is that from your pictures it is evident that the HIgh Pointe has little to no room to the left or right. The Furrion in my 315RLTS has at ~6" on both sides. (The video in the Customer Satisfaction thread shows this clearly.)
The fact that the wall behind the Furrion is a "solid" luan panel (vs a panel with wall covering) is a notable difference, too.
I wish there was testing done with mock-ups of the different installations with temperature data to show what is CAUSING the obvious concentration of heat behind the High Pointe. While I applaud and thank Grand Design for taking action, without knowing details it leaves me wanting to know more. Is it the High Pointe product itself? If so, which models? Is it the cabinet/installation configuration in certain trailers? A combination of both? Why isn't there any sign of damage in my trailer when my wife has informed me she uses the convection feature "all the time--like an oven"?
Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
What interesting is that from your pictures it is evident that the HIgh Pointe has little to no room to the left or right. The Furrion in my 315RLTS has at ~6" on both sides. (The video in the Customer Satisfaction thread shows this clearly.)
The fact that the wall behind the Furrion is a "solid" luan panel (vs a panel with wall covering) is a notable difference, too.
I wish there was testing done with mock-ups of the different installations with temperature data to show what is CAUSING the obvious concentration of heat behind the High Pointe. While I applaud and thank Grand Design for taking action, without knowing details it leaves me wanting to know more. Is it the High Pointe product itself? If so, which models? Is it the cabinet/installation configuration in certain trailers? A combination of both? Why isn't there any sign of damage in my trailer when my wife has informed me she uses the convection feature "all the time--like an oven"?
Hi, howson. Yes, in the 310GK, the oven is tightly sandwiched between the two cabinets. Do you think that the extra space on the sides allows more ventilation in the back? If it is tightly against the outside wall as it is in the 310, I wouldn't think that would make a difference.
It could be a High Pointe issue; to determine that it would be useful to measure cabinet back temperatures of other models when in convection oven mode, with the unit unmounted. It seems like (and I haven't taken the unit apart to determine whether this is true) there is not much insulation / ventilation between the back of the oven compartment per-se and the exterior. That could be how they squeeze a 1.5 cf ft cabinet into the exterior dimensions. It seems that many of the units with the same / similar dimensions are 1.1 cu ft units.
I have no idea why your unit is showing no charring despite regular convection use, since as you noted above the interior of the High Pointe is very similar to the Furrion. Is the bracket which the back of the unit rests on affixed directly to the wall, or is it shimmed out some?
Just thought of this: it is also possible that the absence of the wall paper helps. In our unit, there is a wall paper joint in that space (see the initial post in this thread). Like all such joints, it has a covering tape. When it got warm, the adhesive on the tape let go and the tape touched the oven directly. It was the most charred, and may have caused staining nearby, which I'm interpreting as charring,
Life is an adventure!
Last edited by lobsters; 05-06-2020, 12:36 PM.
Reason: Forgot to respond to part of the quote.
Al and Kathe
:No longer full-time. New sticks and bricks in East Helena, MT
Is the bracket which the back of the unit rests on affixed directly to the wall, or is it shimmed out some?
Directly to the wall, Al. No shim.
Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
It would be interesting to put a thermocouple probe on each side of the new insulation pad, to learn the actual back-of-appliance temperature and the new wall temperature.
What interesting is that from your pictures it is evident that the HIgh Pointe has little to no room to the left or right. The Furrion in my 315RLTS has at ~6" on both sides. (The video in the Customer Satisfaction thread shows this clearly.)
The fact that the wall behind the Furrion is a "solid" luan panel (vs a panel with wall covering) is a notable difference, too.
I wish there was testing done with mock-ups of the different installations with temperature data to show what is CAUSING the obvious concentration of heat behind the High Pointe. While I applaud and thank Grand Design for taking action, without knowing details it leaves me wanting to know more. Is it the High Pointe product itself? If so, which models? Is it the cabinet/installation configuration in certain trailers? A combination of both? Why isn't there any sign of damage in my trailer when my wife has informed me she uses the convection feature "all the time--like an oven"?
I plugged my new 23BHE into my 30AM plug for the first time and it went poof!. My electrican wired my 30 AMP circuite to 220Volt. Learned my lesson on have a line tester and surge protector for 30 Amp service. I took my unit in to be checked and because the High Pointe microwave did not work. They replaced it and told me it was under recall for a heat sheild. Must be the same issue.
...and told me it was under recall for a heat sheild.
Quibble over word choice, but it's technically not a "recall", it's a "customer satisfaction program". The terms, while a lot of folks use them interchangeably, do mean something different. (Regardless, glad you got fixed up!)
Howard
Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
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