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Cleanest basement yet but hot water line is pinched a bit

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  • Cleanest basement yet but hot water line is pinched a bit

    I removed the basement wall in our new 2020 Solitude 310GK-R and found the most organized and cleanest basement of the three Grand Design 5th wheels we've purchased to date. Not great by any stretch but much better. They actually used a wire loom to route some of the wires. Having said that, if I would have turned the camera 90 degrees to the left, you would have seen a rats nest of wires but I wanted to point out one potential problem with my plumbing. The red flexible hose coming from the hot water heater is too short and as a result, bent too sharply. Water flow will be reduced quite a bit by this. I've never worked with PEX hoses or fixtures so I have reading to do on how to fix this.

    Click image for larger version

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    Brian & Kellie
    2020 Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, MORryde IS, 1,460w solar and 540ah BBGC3
    2020 Ford F-350 Platinum SRW PSD Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch

    Previous setups:
    2019 Grand Design Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 Ford F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
    2016 Grand Design Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch

  • #2
    Originally posted by bertschb View Post
    I removed the basement wall in our new 2020 Solitude 310GK-R and found the most organized and cleanest basement of the three Grand Design 5th wheels we've purchased to date. Not great by any stretch but much better. They actually used a wire loom to route some of the wires. Having said that, if I would have turned the camera 90 degrees to the left, you would have seen a rats nest of wires but I wanted to point out one potential problem with my plumbing. The red flexible hose coming from the hot water heater is too short and as a result, bent too sharply. Water flow will be reduced quite a bit by this. I've never worked with PEX hoses or fixtures so I have reading to do on how to fix this.

    Click image for larger version

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    Cate&Rob will know! These kinked lines are unfortunately way too common. Found one on my 315 while doing other work. The really bad thing is that soft hose on the hot water line will (eventually) burst. Paul's( Paul & Deb) let go the last day of the National Rally. Lucky for him his trailer was going to the factory for other work so they fixed it for him!
    Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

    2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus

    Comment


    • #3
      Makes me want to spit nails. Changing the 90 degree fitting on the water heater to a straight fitting would make a nice straight shot to the supply line. Another fix while you are right there is relocate the black tank flush line that is resting on that same fitting. Definitely is a lot neater there than our Reflection but way too much flex hose. I can understand a piece of flex hose for the water pump , vibrations and all , but flex on every other line , that's too much.

      Brian (the other one , or am I number 3)
      Brian & Michelle
      2018 Reflection 29RS
      2022 Chevy 3500HD

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Country Campers View Post
        Another fix while you are right there is relocate the black tank flush line that is resting on that same fitting.
        I didn't even notice that black tank flush line. I was actually in the basement to replace the factory converter/charger with a PD9160AL for my LiFePO4 batteries. Next up is adding the EMS. Once that's done I'll fix that crimped hot water line - assuming I can still function after being crammed in the basement for two days.
        Brian & Kellie
        2020 Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, MORryde IS, 1,460w solar and 540ah BBGC3
        2020 Ford F-350 Platinum SRW PSD Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch

        Previous setups:
        2019 Grand Design Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 Ford F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
        2016 Grand Design Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch

        Comment


        • #5
          bertschb
          Hi Brian,

          With all that space to work, it is a shame that Grand Design chooses to use soft hose. It seems that they use this hose to expedite final assembly . . . but, the result is often a situation as shown in your picture. Pex is very easy to work with. A few "right tools" (see attached) and you will easily add a new skill to your repertoire. Put an elbow on the water heater outlet and come straight across to the T in the Pex line. The T that is there will rotate in the Pex to point at the water heater without creating a leak.

          That black soft hose is curious. Normally black hose is reserved for black tank flush. It looks like that black hose connects to blue Pex. I have seen this on a plant tour and pointed out that this is asking for confusion down the road with blue Pex (normally reserved for potable cold water) now inserted into a black tank flush line. I was assured that this meets RVIA requirements . . . but those who have read my previous posts will know what I think of RVIA "requirements".

          Edit: Added a picture of what that soft hose on the water heater outlet will look like in a couple of years . . . ask me how I know this .

          Rob
          Attached Files
          Last edited by Cate&Rob; 04-02-2020, 07:34 PM.
          Cate & Rob
          (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
          2015 Reflection 303RLS
          2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
          Bayham, Ontario, Canada

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post
            bertschbPut an elbow on the water heater outlet and come straight across to the T in the Pex line.

            That black soft hose is curious. Normally black hose is reserved for black tank flush. It looks like that black hose connects to blue Pex.

            Edit: Added a picture of what that soft hose on the water heater outlet will look like in a couple of years . . . ask me how I know this .

            Rob
            Hi Rob

            I will order some PEX tools and hose. Can you tell me what type of elbow I need for the water heater outlet?

            I remember reading about your burst soft hose a couple years ago. We haven't had a Grand Design RV long enough yet for that to be a problem but I think we'll have this 310GK for more than a year so I may replace all the soft tubing.
            Brian & Kellie
            2020 Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, MORryde IS, 1,460w solar and 540ah BBGC3
            2020 Ford F-350 Platinum SRW PSD Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch

            Previous setups:
            2019 Grand Design Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 Ford F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
            2016 Grand Design Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by bertschb View Post

              Hi Rob

              I will order some PEX tools and hose. Can you tell me what type of elbow I need for the water heater outlet?
              Pex fittings come in all configurations, in plastic or brass, from any Home Depot or similar. The elbow that you need, to get the water heater outlet pointed at the existing T in the Pex lines, is shown on the upper left of page 5 in the previous attachment.

              Rob

              Cate & Rob
              (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
              2015 Reflection 303RLS
              2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
              Bayham, Ontario, Canada

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post
                The elbow that you need, to get the water heater outlet pointed at the existing T in the Pex lines, is shown on the upper left of page 5 in the previous attachment.
                K, thanks again Rob!
                Brian & Kellie
                2020 Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, MORryde IS, 1,460w solar and 540ah BBGC3
                2020 Ford F-350 Platinum SRW PSD Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch

                Previous setups:
                2019 Grand Design Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 Ford F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
                2016 Grand Design Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post

                  Pex fittings come in all configurations, in plastic or brass, from any Home Depot or similar. The elbow that you need, to get the water heater outlet pointed at the existing T in the Pex lines, is shown on the upper left of page 5 in the previous attachment.

                  Rob
                  There is already an elbow on the heater. Would you not want to put a straight fitting there?

                  Brian
                  Brian & Michelle
                  2018 Reflection 29RS
                  2022 Chevy 3500HD

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Country Campers View Post

                    There is already an elbow on the heater. Would you not want to put a straight fitting there?

                    Brian
                    Good question. I'm going to take a closer look at that fitting today. My focus yesterday was really on replacing the converter/charger. I did order several different PEX fittings last night along with hose and tools. I'll replace that fitting and the kinked line once the parts come in. My back should be recovered by then :-)
                    Brian & Kellie
                    2020 Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, MORryde IS, 1,460w solar and 540ah BBGC3
                    2020 Ford F-350 Platinum SRW PSD Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch

                    Previous setups:
                    2019 Grand Design Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 Ford F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
                    2016 Grand Design Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Country Campers View Post

                      There is already an elbow on the heater. Would you not want to put a straight fitting there?

                      Brian
                      bertschb A straight connector out of the water heater would be best, but it is difficult to tell if this will line up directly enough with the Pex T. A short length of Pex from the existing water heater outlet and an elbow could be adjusted to get a no-strain run, straight to the existing T. If the connection to the water heater is an external nut with a cone washer, I would try the straight fitting as Brian suggests (these connections are easy to undo). If it is an internal pipe thread with thread sealer, I would leave it alone and go with the elbow.

                      Rob
                      Cate & Rob
                      (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
                      2015 Reflection 303RLS
                      2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                      Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Here is a close up of the fitting on the hot water line from the water heater. It also shows the black tank flush line above it.

                        Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2285.jpg
Views:	560
Size:	79.3 KB
ID:	15984
                        Brian & Kellie
                        2020 Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, MORryde IS, 1,460w solar and 540ah BBGC3
                        2020 Ford F-350 Platinum SRW PSD Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch

                        Previous setups:
                        2019 Grand Design Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 Ford F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
                        2016 Grand Design Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          bertschb
                          Hi Brian,

                          The black knurled fitting is hand tightened with a cone washer inside. The easiest fitting to remove/replace. I would go with (other) Brian’s suggestion of replacing this with a straight fitting if this is reasonably aligned with the T.

                          Rob
                          Cate & Rob
                          (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
                          2015 Reflection 303RLS
                          2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                          Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post
                            bertschb
                            Hi Brian,

                            The black knurled fitting is hand tightened with a cone washer inside. The easiest fitting to remove/replace. I would go with (other) Brian’s suggestion of replacing this with a straight fitting if this is reasonably aligned with the T.

                            Rob
                            Hi Rob

                            Thanks for the tips. I finished installing the EMS today and as expected, I'm crippled right now. My knee, hip, back and elbow all hurt right now. I'll resume mods/fixes next week after I recover :-)

                            -Brian
                            Brian & Kellie
                            2020 Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, MORryde IS, 1,460w solar and 540ah BBGC3
                            2020 Ford F-350 Platinum SRW PSD Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch

                            Previous setups:
                            2019 Grand Design Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 Ford F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
                            2016 Grand Design Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              bertschb

                              BTW . . . (assuming that this is a Suburban water heater) the white plastic thing between the black fitting and the water heater outlet is the check valve required by Suburban for winterizing. These plastic devices are known to be a problem. There are better brass ones. While you’re fixing plumbing issues . . . . . .

                              Rob
                              Cate & Rob
                              (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
                              2015 Reflection 303RLS
                              2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                              Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                              Comment

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