Lubrication of black and gray tank cables - Take II

[Yoda]

I had a brainstorm this morning while touching up my chloroplast sealing.
Does anyone know the size and thread pitch on the termination hardware and dia of the cable? Its not in the parts lookup. I am thinking I can cobble together a screw on fitting (after handle removal) that might seal well enough to use spray lube down the cable housing. I am assuming the handle is easy to remove with the screw in it. All three dump valves have this arrangement and from what I can see the cable housing if fairly tight in the backside of the assembly.


I was somewhat successful using rubberized tape around the WD40 straw, but still had a mess.

Thoughts?

On edit - the first post in this thread sounds interesting https://www.crossroadsowners.com/for...lube-6527.html

He used 1/2 in plastic tubing twisted on the threads then poured penetrating oil in it (I assumed he held it up) and waited. Might give it a try first.

What oil would folks us for this?

[Country Campers]

Yoda

Keith

According to my micrometers and thread pitch gage you are looking for 9/16-12 , nut or bolt. I am amazed that it is english thread and not that metric stuff ( look out here comes Rob).

Brian

[Yoda]

Yoda

Keith

According to my micrometers and thread pitch gage you are looking for 9/16-12 , nut or bolt. I am amazed that it is english thread and not that metric stuff ( look out here comes Rob).

Brian

Thanks - Don't forget Howard - we cant leave him out of this.

Now to the parts scrounging. I know I have something that will work in the Junk (save for later boxes) I have around here.DW might even think I am cleaning up

Any specific lubricant I should try? I have heard WD40 is not the best - but what I had. I do have some PB Blaster too somewhere.

BTW I think we (US) are one of just 3 or 4 nations that still use English measurements - everyone else is using metric. However I think the US military has changed over, and possibly folks like aircraft/aviation folks. Most cars/trucks are metric too now, OOPS - me thinks we started something now.

Edit - Are our OEM valves LaSalle Bristol ?

[howson]

Yoda -- hate to discourage you, but maybe you don't remember the thread where I tried all this? https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...le-lubrication

There's two sources of resistance in those Bristol valve/cable setups.

The first is in the "knife valve". There is no (none, zero, nada, zip) way to access the interior of the knife valve from the exterior pull handle. Rob installed a Zerk fitting to get grease inside. I drilled a small hole and squirt in lubricant (closing the hole with a small screw when I'm done).

The second resistance is from the corrosion of the steel "cable" (it's actually an actual thin round piece of metal!) inside the sleeve. Once that cable is corroded I found it next to impossible to get the cable to work right again.

For more detailed info, see this thread: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...valves-315rlts

Howard

[bertschb]

Once that cable is corroded I found it next to impossible to get the cable to work right again.

What I started doing with my last 5th wheel was laying a towel over the handles. That prevents water from getting on the cables when you disconnect hoses, etc. Seems to be working well on this and my last 5th wheel. The first one? Not so much. I spilled water onto open valves several times and I know that rusted the cables because I could see the rust later.

[Yoda]

Yoda -- hate to discourage you, but maybe you don't remember the thread where I tried all this? https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...le-lubrication

There's two sources of resistance in those Bristol valve/cable setups.

The first is in the "knife valve". There is no (none, zero, nada, zip) way to access the interior of the knife valve from the exterior pull handle. Rob installed a Zerk fitting to get grease inside. I drilled a small hole and squirt in lubricant (closing the hole with a small screw when I'm done).

The second resistance is from the corrosion of the steel "cable" (it's actually an actual thin round piece of metal!) inside the sleeve. Once that cable is corroded I found it next to impossible to get the cable to work right again.

For more detailed info, see this thread: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...valves-315rlts

Howard

Thanks Howard
Yep I read through your posts and more. No problem now - Looking at this as preventive maintenance. Per the Bristol web page they say they have a lubricating sleeve with no gap for water intrusion. Seems like it does not work so well after seeing your picture. So I thought if I could make something up I could have an easier way to get lubricant in the cable which on my unit makes 90 degree bends.

I am learning here so keep me straight.

Thanks Keith

[Country Campers]

I think aside from the corrosion or rust is the tight bends in the cable. A pic I have from a factory tour shows a 180 degree bend in the cable right at the valve , probably only about 10 inches or so across. This , along with a little corrosion , would cause severe pressure when trying to actuate the valve.

If I am thinking what your are proposing is a small reservoir screwed to the end of the cable mounting threads , with the handle removed of course , to supply a continuous amount of lubricant while sitting still and unused for a while. This would allow the lubricant to slowly work its way down the cable. Seems like a pretty good idea I may try to machine something like this.

Brian

[Yoda]

I think aside from the corrosion or rust is the tight bends in the cable. A pic I have from a factory tour shows a 180 degree bend in the cable right at the valve , probably only about 10 inches or so across. This , along with a little corrosion , would cause severe pressure when trying to actuate the valve.

If I am thinking what your are proposing is a small reservoir screwed to the end of the cable mounting threads , with the handle removed of course , to supply a continuous amount of lubricant while sitting still and unused for a while. This would allow the lubricant to slowly work its way down the cable. Seems like a pretty good idea I may try to machine something like this.

Brian

That's what I was thinking, but maybe a fitting to put pressure behind the lubricant. No one makes anything for lubing RV cables. Go 50/50 on the patent

Keith

[Country Campers]

That's what I was thinking, but maybe a fitting to put pressure behind the lubricant. No one makes anything for lubing RV cables. Go 50/50 on the patent

Keith

For sure , I am not sure if I have seen a grease gun that would handle a "liquid" type lubricant though have to check on that.

Brian

[Cate&Rob]

The gate valve cables are a loose fit in the cable sheath (not like a motorcycle or bike brake cable) . . . so, there is no binding between cable and sheath to be lubricated. The sources of binding are the short length of solid shaft at the pull handle or the seals around the gate valve blade. As Howard describes, there is absolutely no way to lubricate the gate blade by sending lubricant down the cable. Lubricating the solid shaft at the handle can be done with any spray lubricant . . . but, won't likely solve the problem.

On the "metric" part of the discussion . . . the only major country in the world (the Bahamas is the other one) using non-metric measurement, is the US. Fahrenheit and inches are now "US only". Ironically, about 40 years ago, the US was planning to go metric and required the auto industry (and the military?) to convert to metric under penalty of significant fines if this was not accomplished. (I lived this "first hand" in the auto industry.) There was so much push-back from the US public that the government reversed their decision. The auto industry said "no thanks" . . . we have converted (at great expense) to be the same as the rest of the world . . . we will just stay this way. Ford has converted back on many fasteners, but GM has remained metric only.

The Fahrenheit scale is the most arbitrary (an interesting read on Wikipedia as to where this came from) Why should water freeze at 32? (0 makes much more sense) Why should water boil at 212 (100 makes much more sense) 0 is cold outside. 10 is cool (you need a jacket). 20 is room temperature. 30 is a warm day. 40 is getting into Arizona temperatures. Try putting that into random Fahrenheit numbers. But, I digress . . .

Rob

[Yoda]

The gate valve cables are a loose fit in the cable sheath (not like a motorcycle or bike brake cable) . . . so, there is no binding between cable and sheath to be lubricated. The sources of binding are the short length of solid shaft at the pull handle or the seals around the gate valve blade. As Howard describes, there is absolutely no way to lubricate the gate blade by sending lubricant down the cable. Lubricating the solid shaft at the handle can be done with any spray lubricant . . . but, won't likely solve the problem.

On the "metric" part of the discussion . . . the only major country in the world (the Bahamas is the other one) using non-metric measurement, is the US. Fahrenheit and inches are now "US only". Ironically, about 40 years ago, the US was planning to go metric and required the auto industry (and the military?) to convert to metric under penalty of significant fines if this was not accomplished. (I lived this "first hand" in the auto industry.) There was so much push-back from the US public that the government reversed their decision. The auto industry said "no thanks" . . . we have converted (at great expense) to be the same as the rest of the world . . . we will just stay this way. Ford has converted back on many fasteners, but GM has remained metric only.

The Fahrenheit scale is the most arbitrary (an interesting read on Wikipedia as to where this came from) Why should water freeze at 32? (0 makes much more sense) Why should water boil at 212 (100 makes much more sense) 0 is cold outside. 10 is cool (you need a jacket). 20 is room temperature. 30 is a warm day. 40 is getting into Arizona temperatures. Try putting that into random Fahrenheit numbers. But, I digress . . .

Rob

Thanks Rob I needed a good laugh tonight..Makes me wonder what units Yoda used?

[bertschb]

The Fahrenheit scale is the most arbitrary (an interesting read on Wikipedia as to where this came from)

I think Mr Fahrenheit was on drugs when he developed his scale. That was a crazy read on Wiki.

BTW, that wiki article also said this:
"Fahrenheit is still used on virtually all Canadian ovens."

Is this true???

[howson]

Way OT....but Mars Climate Orbiter. That's all you need to know to realize how dumb it is that we have separate systems. (8:08 in this YouTube video)

[Jkwilson]

Maybe check out something like these https://www.denniskirk.com/champions...4aAiqGEALw_wcB

[Cate&Rob]

I think Mr Fahrenheit was on drugs when he developed his scale. That was a crazy read on Wiki.

BTW, that wiki article also said this:
"Fahrenheit is still used on virtually all Canadian ovens."

Is this true???

Apologies for continuing this way off topic diversion . . . but, this observation is true. Canada slowly adopted the metric system in the 70s so anyone who had completed their early education by then, learned the imperial system. For many years the many products imported from the US to Canada had only imperial measurements and this is still true today although by law, everything is supposed to have metric (but can have imperial as well). Add to this that most cookbooks found in Canadian kitchens will have been printed in the US (with Fahrenheit temperatures) and this is why Canadian ovens have Fahrenheit scales.

The current Canadian school system teaches metric. I remember asking one of my kids (when they were younger) if he knew how many inches were in a foot. His best guess. . . probably 10. Everything in measurement is based on 10 . . . right .

The continued use of the imperial system in the US has a large influence over products in Canada where the dimensions are imperial with a "soft" conversion to metric. For example an 8 ft 2x4 will show a 2.4M 50mm x 100mm on the store shelf label but the construction industry still works in the base US imperial inches and ft. Lets not get into why that 2 x 4 is actually 3 1/2 x 1 1/2 just like in the US .

Rob