Undersized axles on Momentum 320G or just poor design?

[chikenstiker]

An update on this post, I now put 20 gallons of water in the grey tank. I flush it first, and put in fresh water, so dumping is not an issue. I have not re-weighed it, but it has pretty much eliminated my sway, although every so often, I think I can see an inch or two of sway, but that could be the road causing it. Not sure what else can be done, other than welding a 300 lb lead weight to the top of the pin box. Next trip, I will get back on the scales.

With the trailer, my front axle weight only goes up 20 lbs.

Is this with or without water in the tank?

I may try this as well, but I really need the Fresh water in the tank, I camp in the boonies.

I'd also consider the adding steel to the front idea, except I'm already at max trailer capacity. It sure stinks to buy a Toy Hauler to haul toys and then have to run without water or add unnecessary weight to the front of it just to tow right.


UPDATES:

I weighed my Patio Kit Gates and they weighed 91 lbs without the brackets and such. I may remove those even though they would only affect front by around 60lbs?

I looked up spec on the 3rd AC unit and it weights 85 lbs. If I removed it, I'd add a fantastic fan so probably only 60 lbs savings and then that only increases Pin by ~40 (not worth the effort?)

I have the 3 season doors and I'm estimating they weigh 100 lbs with the glass maybe more. ~67 lbs added to Pin (But I like the doors...)

Saturday evening I'm borrowing an F350 DRW to see how much difference that makes...

Also found a trailer we really liked but couldn't find in stock when we got ours and working a deal on it, if it's good enough and I can get enough for the 320g I may just jump ship? LOL


On EDIT: Been almost a week and no word back from Grand Design to my service guy...

[howson]

Also found a trailer we really liked but couldn't find in stock when we got ours and working a deal on it, if it's good enough and I can get enough for the 320g I may just jump ship?

Another option to consider. How about completely replacing the current suspension with the Morryde Independent Suspension ("IS"). What I'm thinking is talking with Morryde engineers and asking if it's possible to move the axles back x inches to put more weight on the pin. When they install the IS everything is cut off below the frame and a completely new suspension is installed.

The advantage to this route is you'll fix the problem without any work arounds, you can get 8K axles, and you'll be able to tow at maximum capacity with no worries at all about spring or hanger failures. There's many, many testimonials from IS owners that are very happy with the setup (yours truly included). Get disc brakes while you're at it and don't look back. My write up is here: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...ts-post-1-of-3

May be a pie-in-the-sky idea, but might be worth the question. Contact Brian at Morryde. Who knows?

BRIAN HOSINSKI
brian.hosinski@morryde.com
Service Manager
MORryde International, Inc
(574) 293-1581 x1673

[Wileykid]

Is this with or without water in the tank?

I may try this as well, but I really need the Fresh water in the tank, I camp in the boonies.

I'd also consider the adding steel to the front idea, except I'm already at max trailer capacity. It sure stinks to buy a Toy Hauler to haul toys and then have to run without water or add unnecessary weight to the front of it just to tow right.


UPDATES:

I weighed my Patio Kit Gates and they weighed 91 lbs without the brackets and such. I may remove those even though they would only affect front by around 60lbs?

I looked up spec on the 3rd AC unit and it weights 85 lbs. If I removed it, I'd add a fantastic fan so probably only 60 lbs savings and then that only increases Pin by ~40 (not worth the effort?)

I have the 3 season doors and I'm estimating they weigh 100 lbs with the glass maybe more. ~67 lbs added to Pin (But I like the doors...)

Saturday evening I'm borrowing an F350 DRW to see how much difference that makes...

Also found a trailer we really liked but couldn't find in stock when we got ours and working a deal on it, if it's good enough and I can get enough for the 320g I may just jump ship? LOL


On EDIT: Been almost a week and no word back from Grand Design to my service guy...

Same answer as the messaging between us on the other forum. I wanted to update the forum of the current information that may help others.

[Wileykid]

Another option to consider. How about completely replacing the current suspension with the Morryde Independent Suspension ("IS"). What I'm thinking is talking with Morryde engineers and asking if it's possible to move the axles back x inches to put more weight on the pin. When they install the IS everything is cut off below the frame and a completely new suspension is installed.

The advantage to this route is you'll fix the problem without any work arounds, you can get 8K axles, and you'll be able to tow at maximum capacity with no worries at all about spring or hanger failures. There's many, many testimonials from IS owners that are very happy with the setup (yours truly included). Get disc brakes while you're at it and don't look back. My write up is here: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...ts-post-1-of-3

May be a pie-in-the-sky idea, but might be worth the question. Contact Brian at Morryde. Who knows?

BRIAN HOSINSKI
brian.hosinski@morryde.com
Service Manager
MORryde International, Inc
(574) 293-1581 x1673

That is an interesting idea, but I don't think it would work with the cutouts for the tires. On the left side, you run into the black tank drain, and right behind it is the stabilizer leg. If possible, it would only be a couple of inches at the most.

[chikenstiker]

Another option to consider. How about completely replacing the current suspension with the Morryde Independent Suspension ("IS"). What I'm thinking is talking with Morryde engineers and asking if it's possible to move the axles back x inches to put more weight on the pin. When they install the IS everything is cut off below the frame and a completely new suspension is installed.

The advantage to this route is you'll fix the problem without any work arounds, you can get 8K axles, and you'll be able to tow at maximum capacity with no worries at all about spring or hanger failures. There's many, many testimonials from IS owners that are very happy with the setup (yours truly included). Get disc brakes while you're at it and don't look back. My write up is here: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...ts-post-1-of-3

May be a pie-in-the-sky idea, but might be worth the question. Contact Brian at Morryde. Who knows?

BRIAN HOSINSKI
brian.hosinski@morryde.com
Service Manager
MORryde International, Inc
(574) 293-1581 x1673

This is something I was thinking about. I was thinking of just cutting the current brackets and re welding them myself moving them back even a few inches may be enough? I think I've got a good 6-8" possibly without moving anything else. I looked at the wheel wells though and I think it would end up looking like doo doo not lining up anymore, especially anything more than a couple inches.

I know the Morryde would be an "upgrade", but I'm investing more money to fix a brand/model issue and need to consider cost of all these "fixes" vs dumping the model and moving on to one that doesn't have the issues. Warranty coverage could be an issue too?

Thanks for the link, I appreciate it and check it out right now.

[howson]

That is an interesting idea, but I don't think it would work with the cutouts for the tires. On the left side, you run into the black tank drain, and right behind it is the stabilizer leg. If possible, it would only be a couple of inches at the most.

Well, darn. I didn't think of that. :( Oh well. chikenstiker -- don't miss Wileykid 's post.

[Jlawles2]

How is your tire wear? Wonder if you have an axle alignment issue (have not read back through the whole thread to see if you already checked alignment) Find a good spot where you can drive straight ahead to "relax" the suspension to get everything into the "neutral"position and then measure the center to center of the axles. I do this by measuring from the same point on the front rim to the same point on the rear rim vs trying to eye the center of the axle. I think allowance is 1/8", but you would need to check the dexter axle setup in the manual. https://www.dexteraxle.com/user_area...LIT-122-00.pdf about page 64.

[Wileykid]

How is your tire wear? Wonder if you have an axle alignment issue (have not read back through the whole thread to see if you already checked alignment) Find a good spot where you can drive straight ahead to "relax" the suspension to get everything into the "neutral"position and then measure the center to center of the axles. I do this by measuring from the same point on the front rim to the same point on the rear rim vs trying to eye the center of the axle. I think allowance is 1/8", but you would need to check the dexter axle setup in the manual. https://www.dexteraxle.com/user_area...LIT-122-00.pdf about page 64.

For my trailer, I put 7,000 miles on it this summer, and tires look great. No unusual wear that I can see.

[chikenstiker]

How is your tire wear? Wonder if you have an axle alignment issue (have not read back through the whole thread to see if you already checked alignment) Find a good spot where you can drive straight ahead to "relax" the suspension to get everything into the "neutral"position and then measure the center to center of the axles. I do this by measuring from the same point on the front rim to the same point on the rear rim vs trying to eye the center of the axle. I think allowance is 1/8", but you would need to check the dexter axle setup in the manual. https://www.dexteraxle.com/user_area...LIT-122-00.pdf about page 64.

Tires appear fine. I had Dealer do a full Axle Measurement when it was in for service and all was dead on.

[chikenstiker]

UPDATE:

Cliff Notes: DRW FTW.. Holy Carp, I'd have never guessed it'd make that much difference!!!

Long description:

So, I filed my fresh water full, left all dirt bikes in (3 at the moment), Empty Black and Gray, taken food out and taken the ammo and targets out from the last trip. So trailer should have had the 14.7% or less Pin weight. I wanted an accurate test or if anything a little extra light to represent the usual 4 dirtbikes in back.

Buddy came ofer with '15 F350 DRW 35" tires and small lift. Took a drive up and over the Altamont (I get a lot of sway on the downhills. It towed almost perfectly straight, you could see little sways in the trailer looking in the side mirror, but they were small and then gone. I did a steering wheel whip back and forth on the downhill all prepared to have to hit the trailer brakes and the trailer whipped out maybe 6" and bam cam back with very little movement the opposite direction. It felt Safe, Planted and "Normal". Buddy is in the passenger seat and says that tiny bit of sway is more than my 5th wheels has, but I wouldn't worry about it. I told him that's not how my truck tows. Windy Road back to house at 55-60 and the DRW took the corners with very little swing out if any!

Back to the house and we hook up my truck. Getting on the freeway only doing 40 and buddy looks over at me because he can feel it. Up and over hill the trailer sways out 3-6" occasionally for no reason and comes back with a couple wiggles and you can feel the truck being pushed around. So on the downhill side I give it the same left, right whack of the steering wheel and the trailer hits the bots dots on one side of the lane, then the bots dots on the other side of the lane, then back to the bots dots on the 1st side again and then sways back and forth 5 more times before settling down and the whole time you're getting dizzy in the truck because you feel the truck wagging back and forth. Buddy was like Holy Crap! I told him that's what I deal with on steep downhills and windy days and when big trucks pass! Then the windy road back to the house and every corner the trailer swings out about 6" and then swings back in and stays aligned after that. We also noticed on the side road when you come out of the corner and straighten out the trailer sways just a tad and again makes you almost dizzy because you see your going straight, but the trailer is wagging the back of the truck.

Neither one of us thought the difference would be that great! I would have guessed just a small gain, it was crazy! Driving his DRW I felt comfortable for once, I didn't even care if the Pin was light, it towed damn good enough to me. It had less sway than any tow behind I've ever owned had.

So, family has big decisions to make, Downgrade trailer back to a tow behind and 5-6000 lbs lighter or Upgrade to an F450. Still working on the wife.

[howson]

chikenstiker -- that is very surprising. Could there be something wrong in your truck's suspension (something broken or loose)?

[chikenstiker]

chikenstiker -- that is very surprising. Could there be something wrong in your truck's suspension (something broken or loose)?

Nope. Bilstein shocks are only about 4k old, Air Bags only been on a year, Front and Rear Sway bars recently upgraded to Heavy Duty one's to try and combat this problem. I've had the steering pieces that wear out replaced 8k ago. All is good! I was very surprised the difference it made.

[Jlawles2]

Strange idea, but have are you air bags isolated from each other or tied together. If tied together try either putting a valve between them to see if isolating them will help combat the sway.

Do you have overloads? If not, see if you can find a set (possibly junkyard take offs) and try installing them. The F450 will have a different set of springs and overloads that may be helping with the sway control also.

[Guest]

Joseph may have something here on the lack of the one ton spring pack. Even though the bags are there. It would still be nice to see a side pic of the SRW truck with the rig attached.

Jim

[Wileykid]

Joseph may have something here on the lack of the one ton spring pack. Even though the bags are there. It would still be nice to see a side pic of the SRW truck with the rig attached.

Jim

I thought air bags only supplemented the existing springs?