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Lug nut style (and why to check the torque often)

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  • Lug nut style (and why to check the torque often)

    Hello

    I have black 19mm lug nuts with closed tops on 3 wheels on the 2021 Transcend.

    The fourth wheel was replaced on the road because it was damaged. The replacement came with unpainted open-ended 21mm lug nuts.

    The spare had from the beginning 2 open-ended steel 22mm lug nuts.

    Needless to say this is annoying

    Does someone know what style of nuts these are? I'd like to order some replacements.

    Thanks in advance.

    Some backgroind on why I'm in this situation:

    I've learned the hard way that you really do need to check the torque on trailer lug nuts often, especially if one of the wheels was removed and reinstalled on the road. I thought that was a BS warning, like your car manual's instruction to check your oil at every gas fillup. But it isn't

    Over the last 20 years I switched at least 20×3×4×2=480 wheels on cars. I guess the air tools made me stop paying attention. Without them: you can do little more than hand-tighten the lugs with the wheel off the ground, and when you put the weight of the trailer on the wheel: my guess is the nuts shift off centre, and the 100footpounds torque is not enough to centre them back.

    Curiously when I neglected to do this: instead of the nuts falling off, the loose steel rim slowly ate into the studs, while wearing off at the same time. You end up with a sort of giant baby rattler Lucky I eventually noticed when I pulled out with the windows rolled down.
    2021 Transcend 247BH

  • #2
    Originally posted by AndrewSmith View Post
    Hello

    I have black 19mm lug nuts with closed tops on 3 wheels on the 2021 Transcend.

    The fourth wheel was replaced on the road because it was damaged. The replacement came with unpainted open-ended 21mm lug nuts.

    The spare had from the beginning 2 open-ended steel 22mm lug nuts.

    Needless to say this is annoying

    Does someone know what style of nuts these are? I'd like to order some replacements.

    Thanks in advance.

    Some backgroind on why I'm in this situation:

    I've learned the hard way that you really do need to check the torque on trailer lug nuts often, especially if one of the wheels was removed and reinstalled on the road. I thought that was a BS warning, like your car manual's instruction to check your oil at every gas fillup. But it isn't

    Over the last 20 years I switched at least 20×3×4×2=480 wheels on cars. I guess the air tools made me stop paying attention. Without them: you can do little more than hand-tighten the lugs with the wheel off the ground, and when you put the weight of the trailer on the wheel: my guess is the nuts shift off centre, and the 100footpounds torque is not enough to centre them back.

    Curiously when I neglected to do this: instead of the nuts falling off, the loose steel rim slowly ate into the studs, while wearing off at the same time. You end up with a sort of giant baby rattler Lucky I eventually noticed when I pulled out with the windows rolled down.
    Andrew - that is puzzling. If you axles at Dexter they should be 3/4 nuts on 1/2" studs, possibly 5/8". A good thing to do is get a picture of the axle tag, and if Dexter send it ti them and ask for the build sheet. They will send you all the information on the axle assembly including parts number for everything . My 4400lb axles are 1/2" by 20 studs with 3/4" acorn lug nuts. I believe. I carry a torque wrench me to do the changes and have it set to 110 Ft/Lbs. But your post is timely as I need to double check the tire I changed a few days back. I believe you should be check after 500 miles of the change. (thanks for reminding me to do that

    Keith
    2018 Reflection 150 Series 220RK 5th wheel, SteadyFast system, Star White 2022 F350 King Ranch CC Long bed (HAL), B&W 25K OEM Companion

    Comment


    • #3
      Why would you use different lug nuts when changing a wheel? The nuts that were removed should have been used with the steel spare.

      I usually put the nuts on hand tight then lower the axle until the tire contacts the ground and then torque to spec, then lower jack until full load is on tire then check torque again, and then check again after 50 or so miles.

      Brian
      Brian & Michelle
      2018 Reflection 29RS Oct.2017 build date, EMS-HW50C , Lippert Remote
      2015 Chevy 3500HD CC LB Duramax , Reese Elite 18K

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Yoda View Post
        I carry a torque wrench me to do the changes and have it set to 110 Ft/Lbs:
        Hi Keith . . . just a sidebar comment . . . Always set your torque wrench back to zero between uses or it won’t retain its calibration.

        Rob
        Cate & Rob
        (with Border Collies Molly & Angel)
        2015 Reflection 303RLS
        2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
        Bayham, Ontario, Canada

        Comment


        • #5
          Yoda Kieth, as Rob mentioned, unless you have a split beam, the torque wrench must be returned to zero for storage.

          I think my next one will be similar to this. https://www.tekton.com/1-2-inch-driv...rench-trq62203
          Joseph
          Tow
          Vehicle: 2018 GMC K2500 Denali Diesel
          Coach: 303RLS Delivered March 5, 2021
          South of Houston Texas

          Comment


          • #6
            Jlawles2

            Somewhere I have my "original" torque wrench from 50+ years ago . . . the origin of split beam torque measuring.

            Rob

            Click image for larger version  Name:	WLMW3001C_1200Wx1200H.jpg Views:	0 Size:	20.3 KB ID:	91492
            Cate & Rob
            (with Border Collies Molly & Angel)
            2015 Reflection 303RLS
            2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
            Bayham, Ontario, Canada

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Yoda View Post

              Andrew - that is puzzling. If you axles at Dexter they should be 3/4 nuts on 1/2" studs, possibly 5/8". A good thing to do is get a picture of the axle tag, and if Dexter send it ti them and ask for the build sheet. They will send you all the information on the axle assembly including parts number for everything . My 4400lb axles are 1/2" by 20 studs with 3/4" acorn lug nuts. I believe.:
              They're Lippert. I can't even figure out which one of these is the model number, or whether they're custom made for Grand Design:

              Click image for larger version

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              2021 Transcend 247BH

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Country Campers View Post
                Why would you use different lug nuts when changing a wheel? The nuts that were removed should have been used with the steel spare.

                I usually put the nuts on hand tight then lower the axle until the tire contacts the ground and then torque to spec, then lower jack until full load is on tire then check torque again, and then check again after 50 or so miles.

                Brian
                The old lug nuts had the studs broken off inside them

                How do you torque it with the tire just contacting the ground? Mine rotates even if I put a rubber wheel chock in front of it. I found I have to put at least half the normal weight on it to be able to torque it properly.
                2021 Transcend 247BH

                Comment


                • #9
                  Installing a wheel should be a four step process.
                  1) Install the lug nuts with just a deep socket in your hand (this makes sure that nothing is cross threaded)
                  2) Touch the tire to the ground and torque the nuts to maybe 30 lb-ft. (This makes sure that everything is centred)
                  3) Lower the jack completely and torque the nuts to their final setting.
                  4) Check torque 50 miles later.

                  If used at all, an air tool should only be used for removing lug nuts (in my opinion)

                  Rob
                  Cate & Rob
                  (with Border Collies Molly & Angel)
                  2015 Reflection 303RLS
                  2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                  Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post
                    Installing a wheel should be a four step process.
                    1) Install the lug nuts with just a deep socket in your hand (this makes sure that nothing is cross threaded)
                    2) Touch the tire to the ground and torque the nuts to maybe 30 lb-ft. (This makes sure that everything is centred)
                    3) Lower the jack completely and torque the nuts to their final setting.
                    4) Check torque 50 miles later.
                    I'll remember that next time. But I no longer trust that checking them just once is enough. I removed and replaced 3 of the 4 wheels this summer (mostly due to bad luck punctures) and all of them took at least 5 checks to be consistently torqued.
                    2021 Transcend 247BH

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post
                      Jlawles2

                      Somewhere I have my "original" torque wrench from 50+ years ago . . . the origin of split beam torque measuring.

                      Rob

                      Click image for larger version Name:	WLMW3001C_1200Wx1200H.jpg Views:	0 Size:	20.3 KB ID:	91492
                      Only issue I have ever had with those is trying to read it when you get to the higher end of the range as you are typically in a good strain. Also have to be careful that the needle is not contacting either side of the slot in the scale holder.

                      One of the most accurate torque wrenches out there though.
                      Joseph
                      Tow
                      Vehicle: 2018 GMC K2500 Denali Diesel
                      Coach: 303RLS Delivered March 5, 2021
                      South of Houston Texas

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post

                        Hi Keith . . . just a sidebar comment . . . Always set your torque wrench back to zero between uses or it won’t retain its calibration.

                        Rob
                        Rob, Many torque wrench manufacturers and calibration labs no longer teach the "zero" method. Most of them want you to back the wrench off the the minimum setting on the scale (which may or may not be zero). This is what we were taught in the missile business. Here's an example:

                        https://www.ultratorq.com/in-the-new...rque-wrenches/

                        Jim
                        GDRV Forum Moderator
                        GDRV SW USA Rally Support Coordinator

                        Jim and Ginnie
                        2017 Reflection 297RSTS

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          TucsonJim

                          Agreed Jim. When I said “zero” I meant below the lowest number on the scale without disengaging the mechanisms within the wrench. The intent being to not leave any significant load on the spring inside.

                          Rob
                          Cate & Rob
                          (with Border Collies Molly & Angel)
                          2015 Reflection 303RLS
                          2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                          Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I have a 1/2" battery impact that I use on mine. With the wheel lifted I install the nuts in a cross pattern and lightly snug them up to seat the wheel. Once on the ground I tighten them all in the same pattern. With a good charge in the battery I typically get 100 Lb ft out of the impact. I always verify and set them to 110 Lb ft with my torque wrench.
                            2021 Reflection 337RLS, 2021 Silverado 3500HD 6.6 gas. Nellie the wonder boxer

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post
                              Jlawles2

                              Somewhere I have my "original" torque wrench from 50+ years ago . . . the origin of split beam torque measuring.

                              Rob

                              Click image for larger version Name:	WLMW3001C_1200Wx1200H.jpg Views:	0 Size:	20.3 KB ID:	91492
                              You must have been digging around in my tool box. Just kidding. I have one from the same era, although I haven’t used it since I got the new one for the trailer. So many things that needed proper torque (Anderson fifth-wheel hitch has two different settings, truck wheels have something else, then there are the trailer wheels) that I decided I needed a dedicated one for just our travels. It stays in the front storage of the trailer, in it’s original strong case to protect it. I just had it out yesterday and checked the torque on everything, getting ready for our trip this weekend.

                              My old one is still in the tool box in the garage.
                              Tom and Janice (also known as Richter on the “Other” forum)

                              First came the 18' Comfort bumper-pull, was great for 20 years.
                              Now a 2019 Reflection 303RLS, second air, double glass, table and chairs
                              2019 F350 Lariat 4x4 Crewcab with lots of goodies
                              Andersen aluminum with the puck system holding it all together
                              Cranberry Twp. PA, about 30 miles north of Pittsburgh

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