Reflection 220RK 6K Axle Upgrade Discussion - and help

[Scott'n'Wendy]

I'm surprised Flystar needed that tool. Most times the serrated bolts come out with a pretty light tap. In my experience anyway. YMMV

[Jlawles2]

Yoda Keith, I did axle swap in the parking lot of Holiday Inn in Pecos, Texas. Ideal place, NO. Level, NO. Measurements taken, NO. Mine were a direct replacement from Dexter. Roadside Mechanic brought out 4 bottle jacks bing enough to lift a loaded 18 wheeler EACH. Jacked up outside of the axle spring perches. Had to wire nut the brakes (all he had) till I got home. Hardest part was the bolts. If they only tightened the nut, then the bolt could be an interference fit with Yielded spline areas.

Dexter sent everything including spring straps and bolts. Ask what is included with each setup as the straps and other misc thins may be in there.

[Yoda]

Yoda Keith, I did axle swap in the parking lot of Holiday Inn in Pecos, Texas. Ideal place, NO. Level, NO. Measurements taken, NO. Mine were a direct replacement from Dexter. Roadside Mechanic brought out 4 bottle jacks bing enough to lift a loaded 18 wheeler EACH. Jacked up outside of the axle spring perches. Had to wire nut the brakes (all he had) till I got home. Hardest part was the bolts. If they only tightened the nut, then the bolt could be an interference fit with Yielded spline areas.

Dexter sent everything including spring straps and bolts. Ask what is included with each setup as the straps and other misc thins may be in there.

Thanks
I'll add that to my quote request. The more I think about this I think I may be able to do it. Everything should be a bolt up fit. I should factor in the Gin and Crab, muscles. and butter after its done though. Now to get SWMBO OK on the price. - At this point GD is not on her favorites list.


Keith

[Jlawles2]

Yoda Keith, if you have a furniture dolly (or 2) they will be your best friend.

I suggest jack up the unit, remove the wheels, then lower until almost touches the dolly, then crib. Use some type of wood to shim the difference from the axle to the dolly, the go to work on removing the axle. Use the jack under the opposing axle to push up on the axle you are not working on to lower the one you are working on.

When you get the axles installed, more than likely the shackles will be inverted. When you put the trailer on the wheels, jack up one with the stabilizers down and be prepared for the "POP" when it flips the shackles. If it's not the one you are jacking, swap to the other axle, if it is the one you are jacking on, keep jacking.

[Scott'n'Wendy]

While Joseph didn't measure, and it worked out for him, I recommend that you do. My axles were also a direct replacement from Dexter, but the hole in the top spring and the centring pin and the u-bolt, springs, spring plate stack will give you some slop. Always best to get it back where it was. It only takes ten minutes to measure and you will be 100% sure they are back in original location. All of us that were doing the axle swaps on the Titaniums measured them to be sure.
I could be wrong, but I'm willing to bet Joseph's roadside mechanic had no concerns about alignment...not his trailer.

[Jlawles2]

Scott'n'Wendy After being stuck for days where we were, it never occurred to me to worry about measuring. Truthfully best day with that trailer was when we traded it in on the GD.

[Scott'n'Wendy]

Hi Joseph
Just giving Keith my opinions. And you know what they say about opinions...lol
Just saying, tolerances being what they are...it doesn't hurt to break out the tape measure.

Yes Keith..it is totally within your ability to swap those axles yourself. If your back is a concern...get a couple buddies. The axles are not super heavy...but you are bent over, sliding them under the trailer. Like Joseph said, a couple furniture dollies or similar will help.

[Cate&Rob]

The 3.5 "HW axle quoted is actually a 7 k axle with 0.5 in walls. I think I am going to go with that.The axle tube would no longer be the weak link. As for the sumo springs I will probably reinstall, but just the spring without the spacers so it becomes a traditional bumper.

Keith

1/2” (.5in) wall thickness on the axle tubes is massive ! I don’t think you need to back off on the Sumo contact with tubes like this. This will add a lot of unsprung weight to your suspension system.

Rob

[Yoda]

1/2” (.5in) wall thickness on the axle tubes is massive ! I don’t think you need to back off on the Sumo contact with tubes like this. This will add a lot of unsprung weight to your suspension system.

Rob

Thanks everyone. Tomorrow I will be making a few calls to get exact quotes and verifying wall thickness. I ran across som differing information that its 1/4 stock and only 3/8 HD.
I had a good talk with my neighbor and he has extra jacks and stands that I can borrow and is willing to do what he can to help - his back is worse than mine. He is very concerned about the drive slope as I am. My only other level spot is gravel and weeds. Gave me his thoughts for me to consider on DIY or Dealer options, one of which if something is not right on the axle/spring order it's the shops nickle. He gave me a few names to call and check on the dealer and other install folks that might be able to help me do it at home They are a Big Tex, Diamond C, Wells Cargo, Aluma and Cargo Express trailer dealer (full sales and service) and do carry a lot of inventory. They do the majority of chassis work body installs around here from what I can tell. I keep seeing thier sticker now that I know the name. Shop is clean and well stocked with tools, parts, presses, and welding equipment. The place is also busy.

More later
Keith

BTW - Any thought on the MORryde Heavy Duty Tandem Axle Shackle Kit? Or is there a better option?

[Scott'n'Wendy]

As for the shackles etc..if you are buying from Dexter, maybe they will give you a good price on 'add-ons' to the axle purchase?
Remember going heavy duty on everything has it's limits. Still going to connect to the same less than heavy duty spring hangers already welded to the frame. So beware of going toooo heavy duty. If I remember right, the Mor-ryde HD shackles were a 1/16 or so thicker than Dexters HD shackles. 5/16 vs 3/8. But again 10 year old memory...verify. And if you get thicker shackles...you need longer wet bolts....
For what it's worth, if I was doing the axle swap..I'd move it to the level gravel rather than doing it on the paved incline. I did mine on gravel because...well....my 121m driveway is..all gravel..

[Yoda]

As for the shackles etc..if you are buying from Dexter, maybe they will give you a good price on 'add-ons' to the axle purchase?
Remember going heavy duty on everything has it's limits. Still going to connect to the same less than heavy duty spring hangers already welded to the frame. So beware of going toooo heavy duty. If I remember right, the Mor-ryde HD shackles were a 1/16 or so thicker than Dexters HD shackles. 5/16 vs 3/8. But again 10 year old memory...verify. And if you get thicker shackles...you need longer wet bolts....
For what it's worth, if I was doing the axle swap..I'd move it to the level gravel rather than doing it on the paved incline. I did mine on gravel because...well....my 121m driveway is..all gravel..

Thanks Scott
My stock Dexter shackles are .25 thick. I don't know what shape the are in such as elongated holes. The HD Dexter and MORyde are ,5" thick, but I ran across a lot of folks stripping the MORyde bolts. MORyde has not gotten back to me yet. I am now searching Dexter for the same kit or HD hackle sets (they have), but I am not finding wet bolt sets yet.

Keith

[Scott'n'Wendy]

Wow! They stepped up the shackles to 1/2"?!?. Wonder what's on the 303..never really looked that closely.
Shackles, wet bolts, bushings and equalizers all come in a set still don't they?
If by the stripping of mor-ryde bolts you are referring to the zerks on the heads, I had that happen on my dexter bolts as well.

[Bigdog3162]

Wow.... all this axle and suspension failure talk for these units concerns me! I am surprised they do not hold up well.
Yoda - do you think it was a single heavy impact to the suspension or just normal wear? I've encountered a few bridge/highway transitions that were unexpectedly jarring. Heck, just go ahead and weld a "tag axle" under there while you are at it.
sorry to hear of the troubles.
Rob

[Yoda]

Wow.... all this axle and suspension failure talk for these units concerns me! I am surprised they do not hold up well.
Yoda - do you think it was a single heavy impact to the suspension or just normal wear? I've encountered a few bridge/highway transitions that were unexpectedly jarring. Heck, just go ahead and weld a "tag axle" under there while you are at it.
sorry to hear of the troubles.
Rob

Rob
I am sure it was multiple hard hits well above normal wear. This happen on my Alaska trip with many frost heaves and massive deep pot holes. I missed most, but a few got me. Trailer was not overloaded, but well stocked. The 4200lb axles only have a 3" dia - 0.16" thick wall (Dexter says LT -wall) - not much. Also the overhang (distance from spring seat to hub face is near maximum) if I measured correctly. Also I am slightly nose high, so the rear axle has a bit more weight on it. With the upgrade I should solve that issue. I'm sure it was all to save weight and just have component's that meets the requirements. In normal use you should be fine. Just check tire wear frequently.

MORyde got back to me and I have the correct kit chosen and explained why folks are stripping the bolts. The knurled head must be fully seated before install. Folks were trying to pull the bolt home with the nut - exceeding the torque limits.

The Saga continues
Keith

[Scott'n'Wendy]

Wow.... all this axle and suspension failure talk for these units concerns me!
Rob

Remember, the failures Joseph and I are referring to were not GD trailers.