Need Advice on Replacing my Regulator

[BillM321]

I got the recall notice in the mail the other day about the propane regulator. I called the local dealer and their service department is booked until September. We are leaving on a trip next week so I decided to just eat the cost and replace the regulator myself.

This recall explains a lot about what I experienced on our maiden voyage a few weeks ago. I noticed that I couldn't get the burner on the stove down as low as I thought it should go when I was percolating some morning coffee. I also had (for the 1st time in my life) a propane tank lock itself out. I fixed that by shutting everything off and waiting a while and then very very slowly opening the valve.

Both of those issues probably indicated that I had a faulty regulator that was allowing too much propane at too high of a pressure into my gas lines. And that is exactly what the recall is to address if I understand this correctly. But I didn't put 2 and 2 together until I got the recall notice in mail.


So I ordered a Flame King (KT12ACR6a) 2-Stage Auto Changeover and it was delivered today.


I have never replaced a regulator so I have a few questions:

1. Can anybody tell me if there is any reason I should not use this Flame King? I assumed all these types of regulators were all pretty much the same.

2. From the little bit of online research I have done it appears to be as simple as putting some yellow gas-rated PTFE tape on the threads of the line coming from the Trailer and then threading that into the bottom of the regulator. I plan to hand tighten and make sure I am not cross-threading and then give it a final snug up with a wrench. I will follow that up with a leak test using a spray bottle of soapy water. Is that all there is to it?

3. I know the GD recall notice mentioned a manometer test. I am not 100% sure what that entails, but I assume it is to make sure the new regulator is putting out the correct low pressure (11 PSI or something around there). It appears that many people have replaced bad regulators themselves and I suspect the manometer test is probably not being done. How important is that test?

Any other advice and suggestions would be most welcome.

Thanks,

[Jlawles2]

BillM321 Bill, Be careful in removing the old regulator. Seems I have read on here where the fitting was damaged some how. You may check with a local propane supply company about making the change over for you as they will have the necessary gauges to test the pressures.

Gas pressures are measured in Inches of Water if I remember correctly.

From https://inspectapedia.com/plumbing/G...Regulators.php "On a manometer, with at least half of the gas appliances working you have to see a total of 11 inches of water (pressure) on the readout scale. You may need to adjust the suppy regulator to achieve that pressure."

Quick online check and 11 in H2O is approx 0.4psi.

Second source: https://gashosesandregulators.com/pr...latorfacts.php

"Pressure in a propane tank, large or small, can range between 100 and 200 psi...or even higher when the tank gets hot in the sun. This propane tank pressure must be reduced and be regulated for use in a home, motor home, camper, or an outdoor gas appliance. A residential application will require a low pressure regulator which reduces the gas pressure to 6 ounces (10.5 inches water column).This low pressure regulator will be located on or near the main supply tank to the home, motor home, or camper. "

[howson]

Any other advice and suggestions would be most welcome.

I haven't read the actual recall notice (yet), but it's my understanding Grand Design is also including a propane pressure test as a requirement to fulfill the recall. Individuals replace regulators every day without doing a pressure check, so it's not likely to be an issue. My purpose in writing this is to ensure you understand there will be an open safety recall "on the books" against your trailer until GD has a record of the test's completion.

My .02 (and probably worth just as much)...ask your dealer to schedule a "same day" appointment to get your new (free) regulator and the test done. (Hopefully you didn't throw away the bad one.) The work shouldn't take a trained technician more than 30 minutes. Even if it's six months from now that's fine--just insist on an appt where the work is done the day you bring it in (while you wait). Put the free regulator in your spare bin.

If you happen to be passing by Elkhart, Indiana, maybe the factory service center will do it. Again--should be a quick in and out.

Howard

[Petrovsky]

I have replaced the regulators in my Jayco TT and my two previous pop-up trailers. I have always had a back-up regulator with me since the I needed one with my previous pop-up T. Just make sure you do a leak test thorough leak test. I agree with Howard on how GD will monitor who gets it done and who doesn't. However, you can use the regulator you have purchased for now but to satisfy GD you will likely need them to replace the regulator with the approved replacement. Like Howard mentioned, it only takes 30 min without the leak test to install.

[tortuga]

when the change is completed test all connections for leaks with a sloppy supply of soapy water. any bubbles indicate a leak. FIX IT.

any pipe thread connections need thread sealant. this does not apply to the tank connector.

[StephenO]

From my conversation with Grand Design, they did require a pressure and leak test to be carried out by 'your dealer', and that needed to be documented against your VIN for the recall to be completed. They also needed the old regulator back as part of the recall, so don't throw it out! From my keyboard researching, sounds like the pressure test is done to fine tune the regulator in the installed application. IE, they come set to 11" WC from the factory, but they should be verified once installed for correct pressure and ensure the system is holding the 11"WC.

My thoughts for your questions, but I am not confident my thoughts are even worth $0.02

1. Can anybody tell me if there is any reason I should not use this Flame King? I assumed all these types of regulators were all pretty much the same.

I would at least check that the Flame King unit you picked up has a similar BTU/hr capacity as the Winntec. I know for our trailer the previous BTU/hr rating was waaaaay higher than the total of all the appliances ratings added together, but I decided to keep the BTU rating as close as possible as the previous regulator. In fact, the new regulator I put on has a higher rating than the last, but it was all I could find. I had read some reviews on Amazon that the Flame King regulators leaked when installed, so make sure to do a thorough soap test.

2. From the little bit of online research I have done it appears to be as simple as putting some yellow gas-rated PTFE tape on the threads of the line coming from the Trailer and then threading that into the bottom of the regulator. I plan to hand tighten and make sure I am not cross-threading and then give it a final snug up with a wrench. I will follow that up with a leak test using a spray bottle of soapy water. Is that all there is to it?

The 3/8MPT x 1/2 Male Flare fitting was difficult to remove from the regulator, and needed a couple of wrenches to accomplish that task. The pipe thread fittings need a sealant suitable for gas fittings, but any flare fittings should not have a sealant put on them (from my understanding, but I am not a gas fitter!) In the end though, I needed to (carefully) undo the flare fitting at the trailer, and that made the rebuilding of the regulator and the propane pigtails easier. Like Jlawles2 mentioned, be careful with all the fittings

[BillM321]

This weekend I replaced my OEM Winn Tech regulator with the Fame King I mentioned above. The specs say it is factory set at: Outlet Pressure = 280±50 mm H2O, and Google says 280mm equates to 11". But of course I am sure that is set at where ever the factory is and whatever elevation and air pressure / temperature it happened to be at the factory that day.

I verified there were no leaks with a $25 gas detector from Home Depot and also with a spray bottle of soapy water. Checked it multiple times over the course of several hours, so I think I am good to go there. I will still schedule the official recall to be performed by a GD dealer later in the season when they have an opening.

I could definitely tell that the flame on the stove top was not as intense when turned down to it lowest setting, so I think the replacement did actually help.

Thanks again for everyone's' input and advice.

[Washout]

does anybody know what Grand Design is using for a replacment for the Winntec propane regulater? or even suggesting??

Rich M
2021 imagine 2970RL
2019 Ram 5.7 Hemi

[StephenO]

does anybody know what Grand Design is using for a replacment for the Winntec propane regulater? or even suggesting??

Rich M
2021 imagine 2970RL
2019 Ram 5.7 Hemi

According to the FAQ PDF on Grand Design's website (https://www.granddesignrv.com/sites/...ts-6.28.21.pdf) it says any regulator that is rated for 11" WC can be used, aside from a Winntec model. However, it says to discuss with GD Customer Service recall team.

Based on the amount of demand there is, and size of the recall, I would assume they are using whatever brand is available...

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[Guest]

does anybody know what Grand Design is using for a replacment for the Winntec propane regulater? or even suggesting??

Rich M
2021 imagine 2970RL
2019 Ram 5.7 Hemi

I replaced mine with the Flame King per BillM321 and found the performance to be acceptable. I have an appointment in October with a local dealer but for now, I'm going camping.

Jim

[Gibsonguy]

Be sure the BTU OUTPUT rating can handle the total appliances output rating.soap bubble every fitting you’ll be fine. The new regulator should be preset 8-11inches of water column. if you have a manometer you can check it at each appliance it will be the outlet side Of each gas valve , With the appliance running of course. I spoke with the factory in regards to our camper which does have the faulty regulator she would not let me do the repair and I have a masters in mech. And gas . Just like everybody else I did not want my camper to stay at a dealer for weeks, so I did the repair work myself. And yes I bought line regulator somethings you just got to take control of.........🤨dawn dish soap and a little water .... more soap than water works great. When we pressure test a gas piping system we put in nitrogen at 15 pounds but you cannot put 15 pounds of pressure at the appliance, it will destroy the gas valve on the appliance and we let it sit for 24 hours and you take the reading. The reason why we use nitrogen is because it’s a stable gas and will not increase on pressure at temp swings. Use pipe dope or Teflon tape when threading the fittings! THE Most important factor IS IT MAY VOID YOUR WARRANTY IF YOU PERFORM This.😏😏

[fognet]

Called GD today. They insist I take my 22MLE too a dealer. Called the dealer that is 120 miles round trip. They said it is mandatory I bring my RV in and they will determine what to do. They will not allow me to simply bring regulator in for inspection and possible exchange. Hope we don’t catch on fire because I am not going to jump through the hassle hoops. Seem like GD would allow a simple exchange.

[Gibsonguy]

It’s all about liability.the end.They told me the same thing.IM BLESSED FOR HAVING THE KNOWLEDGE,IF SOMEONE IS ‘HALF WAY’ MECHANICALLY ENCLINED IT WILL BE CAKE.Seems like COVID has made everybody scared of something!

[Country Campers]

The NHSTA who recommends or requires the recall sets the parameters for the recall that all manufacturers must comply with. This is ALL manufacturers not just Grand Design. In order for all manufacturers to comply with any recall they must provide documentation that all units effected by said recall have met the recall parameters.

Brian, Moderator

[BillM321]

Quick Update:

We are getting ready to leave on our last trip of the year, and unlike previous Summer trips, this time we will need to use propane as we are going to need to run the furnace. In preparation for the trip, I went to fire up the furnace this morning to burn off the smell, but I couldn't get the propane to flow without triggering the safety shutoff in the propane tank(s). And I now know that means gas is flowing too fast (a.k.a. a leak somewhere).

Long story short....I used soapy water and found leaks in both of my pigtails right where the rubber hose connects to the crimped metal fitting (see photo). So I picked up some new pigtails locally and replaced the ones that were pre-installed on the Flame King regulator. All seems fine and I am not finding any leaks.




No joints were leaking in July when I replaced the OEM recalled regulator with a the Flame King regulator. I verified this with a gas leak detector wand and also with soapy water several times over the course of a few days. I can also say that there were no sharp kinks or excessive curves on the rubber lines that would put pressure on the joint where the metal and rubber meet. So why now 2 months later these factory crimped fittings are leaking is a mystery to me. Granted it is much cooler weather now than it was in July, but those fittings should not expand or contract enough to allow a leak no matter what the ambient temperature is.

But regardless....the whole point of me posting this is to remind folks to check. I am not saying that this is definitively a problem with the Flame King regulators.....but if you replaced your regulator with a Flame King, then I would suggest you do another leak check just to make sure all is still well.