School of thought / experience with cold weather camping

[TucsonJim]

Hi Joseph,

Not significant to this cold weather discussion, but somewhere (that I can't currently find) on this forum is a post about reflective foil inside a plastic dome trapping excessive heat in a hot environment and damaging the plastic dome.

Rob

That was me. I put a dark tint over the inside panel of both skylights. The dark tint absorbed light and heated up so much that it cracked and deformed both of the inner panels.

Jim

[Guest]

Not to go off in the weeds but my smoke Maxxair vents became severely brittle after a few seasons. Replaced with white Maxxair 2. Our shower skylight from GD is smoke where we have had no issues with it.

Jim

[Cate&Rob]

That was me. I put a dark tint over the inside panel of both skylights. The dark tint absorbed light and heated up so much that it cracked and deformed both of the inner panels.

Jim

Well . . . I "kinda sorta" remembered the situation. Not exactly reflective foil inside the dome. Thanks Canyonlight Dan for remembering better than I do .

Rob

[NoPeeking]

For me, this is a risk analysis question and I tend towards the lower risk option when possible... I would whether spend a few minutes protecting against freezing than several hours or days repairing damage from freezing.

Me too. How much do you trust the weather forecast when a few degrees and/or a few hours matter?

Mike

[JBill9694]

NoPeeking, I, like I suspect most of us, use the weather app on my phone to track temperature forecast. I think often about getting a thermometer to compare the current temperature on my phone to the actual temperature of where I am, but never seem to think about it at the right time to do anything about it. So, I take the predicted low with a grain of salt , considering the following:

The logarithm used to forecast the temperatures compares current conditions to historic conditions at weather recording stations to make the predictions. The more historic data available and the more consistent that data is the better the prediction. However, the old joke about the reliability of the weatherman has some basses in truth, and since we are talking about risk here, I assume that the actual low temperature will be lower than the forecasted low.

We have never been camped right on top of a weather recording station which are traditionally at airfields, so there is another level of uncertainty. Depending on elevation, ground cover, vegetation cover, solar exposure, prevailing wind direction and strength, and a host of other factors, the temperature where we are can be several degrees different than at the weather recording station.

I always keep in mind an "Ask This Old House" clip on what happens to the pressure in a water system as temperature drops (How a Frozen Pipe Bursts | Ask This Old House - Bing video). It would have been nice if they had included a thermometer in the system as well as a pressure gauge, but they didn't. Anyways, the pressure starts to build in a closed system pretty much as soon as there is a temperature change at some point in the system. The temperature doesn't need to get to freezing and stay there for hours to cause damage. Yes, there are some thermodynamics involved and others can pitch in with rational discussions on temperature gain and loss over time. All I know is that I've got 50' of hose laying on the ground and that I'm not going to get up every hour to see if it's been cold enough for long enough to freeze even one inch of that hose.

With all of the above in consideration, I can say that about 40 degrees F, my pucker factor goes into effect. Lower than that and I'm likely filling my freshwater tanks and draining my hose.

[Schiefswret]

TY John, appreciate your input.

[Guest]

Interesting that where my rig is stored will hit 32F tonight for about three hours according to the weather. I will be there tomorrow to load up for a trip to PA to a lot we have there. I'll post if I have an issue before we leave where we will be traveling with full water.

Jim

[Schiefswret]

My bet is that 3 hrs at 32 is not anywhere near enough to freeze 45 gallons of water. Good luck, travel safely.

[d2reid]

Could not find a better Topic area to put this, pls move it if necessary.
Im experiencing two different views on the topic of cold weather freezing external water pipes.

1. If the temp dips below 32 after about 6pm and the next morning the temp starts to rise consistently to above 32 for the rest of the day, and does this for each
day of the period in question, there is no need to go to any extravagant measures to protect any part of your system from freezing to a degree that is likely to cause damage. OR;

2. If the temp drops to 32 or below and stays that way for 4 or more consecutive hours, (no other criteria was provided) take the following measures; 1,2,3,4,5, etc,

Pls advise your thoughts and especially those who have had practical experience in this area. TYIA

Late to the party. After wintering at ski resorts for the last 5 years I hve taken many measures to protect my RV during severe cold. However, we are changing it up this year and headed to Florida for the winter, family stuff. So the last few nights we spent at Echo Bluff State Park in Missouri the temps dropped to 26-28 each night. The only thing I did was unhook the water hose each night and drain it. Ran off internal tank. Next morning it would hit above freezing by breakfast so I would hook hose back up.

In the coldest weather, -22f, I have never had a problem with the low water drain.

Freezing is a matter of temperature, volume and time. 28f for two hours will not freeze a water hose solid. 29f for 8 hours will. This isn't a scientific explanation, but an observation of living in cold.

[Guest]

We are camping in PA where Temps at night have dropped to 32F. Another piece of info is that our lithium battery in the passthrough has been at 47F with heat on set to 70

[KEEHALLMAN]

Late to the party. After wintering at ski resorts for the last 5 years I hve taken many measures to protect my RV during severe cold. However, we are changing it up this year and headed to Florida for the winter, family stuff. So the last few nights we spent at Echo Bluff State Park in Missouri the temps dropped to 26-28 each night. The only thing I did was unhook the water hose each night and drain it. Ran off internal tank. Next morning it would hit above freezing by breakfast so I would hook hose back up.

In the coldest weather, -22f, I have never had a problem with the low water drain.

Freezing is a matter of temperature, volume and time. 28f for two hours will not freeze a water hose solid. 29f for 8 hours will. This isn't a scientific explanation, but an observation of living in cold.

d2reid, was it a heated hose? If yes, am I right that you felt vulnerable with a heated hose at 26 degrees nighttime?

[d2reid]

d2reid, was it a heated hose? If yes, am I right that you felt vulnerable with a heated hose at 26 degrees nighttime?

Hose was not heated.
I have minor trepidations about carcinogens from water hoses breaking down. After a season heated hoses tend to get a bit nasty. So each spring I toss the heated hose and buy a new hose. I realize this is an unsubstantianted phobia, it's probably fine. So last spring I tossed my heated hose. I only had a summer hose and had not obtained a new heated hose as we had planned on spending this winter in Florida. So as I am writing this it got down to 28F last night here in Orlando FL. But it didn't stay cold enough, long enough, to freeze my summer hose.

[JBill9694]

We don't go looking for sub-freezing weather but have been caught several times. Sometimes with below freezing only at night, and other times with the mercury staying at the bottom of the thermometer for several days. Our procedure is the same regardless of duration: Water in the freshwater tanks, tank heating pads on, and water hose (unheated) disconnected and drained. Filling of the tanks take the longest with topping them off after a day or two of use considerably less time. Disconnecting and draining the hose is only a matter of a few minutes.

Is this extreme and unnecessary for a few hours of cold temperatures during the night? Maybe, maybe not. One thing is certain, right or wrong we still don't have any burst pipes or leaking fittings the next day. It is all a question of risk and the cost to mitigate that risk. For us, even at low risk it is worth the cost of mitigating that risk.

OBTW, we also don't have problems with the low point drains. The valves on these drains are located in the heated zone of the basement, next to the nautilus controls, with normally empty piping extending down through the bottom.