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  • #31
    strycharske We finally found out what their intention was. The main breaker panel actually has the last three breakers on a sub panel. So the first "inverter"breaker has the Romex out, then it loops out to the front bay or pass through and feeds the sub panel via the second "inverter" breaker. Then the last two breakers are fed by the sub panel. If installing an inverter, you cut the Romex, figure out which one is the in and which one is the out and feed the in into your inverter in and the out into your inverter out.

    Obviously if you want to run the whole trailer off the inverter this setup does not work and you need to do what you described. If you want to eliminate the inverter prep Romex, take it off of the two inverter breakers and pull it out, then cut a piece of the black 10 gauge out of the Romex and jump the two inverter breakers together. This will do the same thing as the long loop of Romex but be much cleaner.
    Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

    Neil Citro
    2018 Reflection 28BH Pepwave
    2019 F350 6.7L Long Bed Crew Cab

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    • #32
      You could leave the prep line where it is and not use it for your install. If you change RV's you may want to take you new stuff out and move to the next RV. Leaving the factory inverter prep line in there could be beneficial to the next owner.

      Brian
      Brian & Michelle
      2018 Reflection 29RS
      2022 Chevy 3500HD

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      • #33
        Hi guys Just wondering since the 28bh is a 50amp service and the inverter prep is wired to 2 30amp Breakers, is it possible Grand Design did that so you could wire 2 inverters one for each phase of the panel?

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Marc61447 View Post
          Hi guys Just wondering since the 28bh is a 50amp service and the inverter prep is wired to 2 30amp Breakers, is it possible Grand Design did that so you could wire 2 inverters one for each phase of the panel?
          See my reply in the other thread, but no those two 30 amp breakers are designed to be one feeding the inverter and one as a "main" for a subpanel which is just the last two breakers. There is actually a break in the bus bar in the breaker panel between those two 30 amp breakers.
          Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

          Neil Citro
          2018 Reflection 28BH Pepwave
          2019 F350 6.7L Long Bed Crew Cab

          Comment


          • #35
            Hi All,

            I just want to make sure that I am hearing what I think I am hearing. The breaker panel is really broken up into two panels, the main panel which for me is everything to one side of the inverter prep breakers and the sub panel which for me includes the microwave, General, and GFCI. The inverter prep as currently installed would only provide power to the sub and not the entire set of AC breakers. Correct or did I miss this again? While at some point I would love to do the Victron Multiplus, I really have no compelling need to do so, other than I would like to which is hard to justify to the boss. I would however like to wire in a smaller inverter to the GFCI circuits to keep the TV and other outlets online if needed. With the fridge already on DC, other than the AC, and microwave, I am not missing much so if i can run the TV, and keep the outside mini-fridge running, I would be good. What have I missed? Thanks Al
            Al and Diane

            2022 28BH - (6) Chins 100AH, MultiPlus 2, (2) 100/30CC, 1.4KW solar
            RAM 2019 2500 Cummins crew cab short bed
            PullRite SuperGlide

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by allenrude View Post
              Hi All,

              I just want to make sure that I am hearing what I think I am hearing. The breaker panel is really broken up into two panels, the main panel which for me is everything to one side of the inverter prep breakers and the sub panel which for me includes the microwave, General, and GFCI. The inverter prep as currently installed would only provide power to the sub and not the entire set of AC breakers. Correct or did I miss this again? While at some point I would love to do the Victron Multiplus, I really have no compelling need to do so, other than I would like to which is hard to justify to the boss. I would however like to wire in a smaller inverter to the GFCI circuits to keep the TV and other outlets online if needed. With the fridge already on DC, other than the AC, and microwave, I am not missing much so if i can run the TV, and keep the outside mini-fridge running, I would be good. What have I missed? Thanks Al
              That's correct. If you pull out the breakers, you'll see the bus bar across the top is actually broken between the two inverter breakers. If you wire it with the inverter prep, only the circuits to the right of the rightmost inverter breaker will run off of the inverter. You're certainly not required to use a Multiplus, but it is designed to use either an inverter with a built in transfer switch or you'd need to wire in an external transfer switch. Otherwise those circuits would run off of the inverter all the time even when you were on shore power.

              Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

              Neil Citro
              2018 Reflection 28BH Pepwave
              2019 F350 6.7L Long Bed Crew Cab

              Comment


              • #37
                Thanks Neil,

                took a long time to get to this place in the discussion. Not sure why we have to reverse engineer everything just to figure out why things work the way they work, but think I get it now. Still not sure where I will end up. Considering I have the sub panel with the outlets on it already, thats a start as thats about all I really want or need to run on an inverter. I am thinking of adding the Victron 1200VA inverter to just run the sub panel, pulling out the inverter prep breaker thats on the main breaker panel as I wont need it, and moving the microwave off the sub panel onto a separate 15A breaker on the main where the inverter prep breaker was, leaving the General and GFCI breakers on the sub and then running those off the inverter. Do you see any reason why that would not work? I hate to have to go and add a ATS just to switch the inverter to run some outlets. Thanks
                Al
                Al and Diane

                2022 28BH - (6) Chins 100AH, MultiPlus 2, (2) 100/30CC, 1.4KW solar
                RAM 2019 2500 Cummins crew cab short bed
                PullRite SuperGlide

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by allenrude View Post
                  Thanks Neil,

                  took a long time to get to this place in the discussion. Not sure why we have to reverse engineer everything just to figure out why things work the way they work, but think I get it now. Still not sure where I will end up. Considering I have the sub panel with the outlets on it already, thats a start as thats about all I really want or need to run on an inverter. I am thinking of adding the Victron 1200VA inverter to just run the sub panel, pulling out the inverter prep breaker thats on the main breaker panel as I wont need it, and moving the microwave off the sub panel onto a separate 15A breaker on the main where the inverter prep breaker was, leaving the General and GFCI breakers on the sub and then running those off the inverter. Do you see any reason why that would not work? I hate to have to go and add a ATS just to switch the inverter to run some outlets. Thanks
                  Al
                  I don't know much about the 1200VA inverter but if it has an interval transfer switch you should be good to go. You'll need to keep the inverter breakers as that's how pass through power gets into the inverter.

                  Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

                  Neil Citro
                  2018 Reflection 28BH Pepwave
                  2019 F350 6.7L Long Bed Crew Cab

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Thanks Neil,

                    I will have to think more on this. I know other manufacturers have switched outlets available when on the inverter, just dont they know how they do it. I could just leave the GFI and General outlets full time on the inverter and leave the rest on the normal shore power. Just not sure its practical to leaver the inverter on 24/7 regardless of how little the outlets are actually pulling. What do you think?

                    Thanks
                    Al
                    Al and Diane

                    2022 28BH - (6) Chins 100AH, MultiPlus 2, (2) 100/30CC, 1.4KW solar
                    RAM 2019 2500 Cummins crew cab short bed
                    PullRite SuperGlide

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by allenrude View Post
                      Thanks Neil,

                      I will have to think more on this. I know other manufacturers have switched outlets available when on the inverter, just dont they know how they do it. I could just leave the GFI and General outlets full time on the inverter and leave the rest on the normal shore power. Just not sure its practical to leaver the inverter on 24/7 regardless of how little the outlets are actually pulling. What do you think?

                      Thanks
                      Al
                      Yeah I have given thought to this when discussing setups with friends but no one I know has ever actually done it. I have to think its additional wear and tear on your batteries and inverter thats not needed. I tend to run some fairly high amperage things in my GFCI outlets, a crock pot or instant pot on occasion, my wife will run a hair dryer etc. I could see an occasional overload on the inverter when I have plenty of shore power backing it up.
                      Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

                      Neil Citro
                      2018 Reflection 28BH Pepwave
                      2019 F350 6.7L Long Bed Crew Cab

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by allenrude View Post
                        Just not sure its practical to leaver the inverter on 24/7 regardless of how little the outlets are actually pulling. What do you think?
                        Anyone who camps extensively off grid would be running their inverter 24/7. We used to do this for days at a time on our boat. As long as you are not pushing the inverter to its limits, leaving it on 24/7 should not be a problem.

                        Rob

                        Cate & Rob
                        (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
                        2015 Reflection 303RLS
                        2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
                        Bayham, Ontario, Canada

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Cate&Rob View Post

                          Anyone who camps extensively off grid would be running their inverter 24/7. We used to do this for days at a time on our boat. As long as you are not pushing the inverter to its limits, leaving it on 24/7 should not be a problem.

                          Rob
                          I agree its probably okay, but what do you think about the strain on the batteries? I suppose as long as we are talking about LiFePO4 its probably not an issue? Obviously the issue of a overload of the inverter would still be an issue, but as long as you can manage that it could be do-able?
                          Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

                          Neil Citro
                          2018 Reflection 28BH Pepwave
                          2019 F350 6.7L Long Bed Crew Cab

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Hi all,

                            Been a while but I continue to mull this topic over as I have not gotten to this project as yet but still want to get to it this year. I think I have the steps down to clean this up after more thought and reading again all of your inputs in the thread. So hear goes:
                            1. Find out where in the underbelly the 2 inverter prep wires ended up and pull to the front compartment.
                            2. Cut the prep wires and inset an 30A ATS. Dont need a 50A as all I am going to power is the 3 breaker sub panel with the inverter. So shore power IN on the ATS is actually one side of the inverter prep wires from the main panel breakers. So then the other AC leg goes to the sub panel. Inverter is the 3rd leg.
                            3. Arrange the breakers so on the sub panel all I have are 3 breakers, one for the GFI leg, one for the non GFI outlets, and the 30amp outlet for the inverter prep run. This move the microwave off to the main panel.

                            So with this if I lose shore power the sub panel with my outlets are energized from the inverter. Thats all I really wanted, I can run the mini fridge, the TV, and an AC fan if I want. Can it be this simple?

                            On a related note we had a bad storm go thru the Mid-Atlantic states last week and we got hammered. We were without power for 6 days. The RV was a life saver with the big 12V fridge. With my solar install and sunny days, my wife is now a believer. If I had the inverter project completed, we would also have had fans, and TV, but regardless saved the day. Now if I had just had some fresh water in the tanks we would have been all set. If I had known we would be almost a week with no power, I would have just hitched up and headed for a campground and plugged in and come back when we had power.
                            Al and Diane

                            2022 28BH - (6) Chins 100AH, MultiPlus 2, (2) 100/30CC, 1.4KW solar
                            RAM 2019 2500 Cummins crew cab short bed
                            PullRite SuperGlide

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              For anyone that may be interested, I wanted to get back with the results of my many months of solar and electrical work on the 2022 28BH, and send on a picture of the completed project, with a lot of thanks to all you folks that helped out along the way. It has been a real learning experience and while not my first RV by any means, but my first trip down the solar rat hole. Expensive but enjoyable and all appears to work as designed (or in truth, evolved).

                              My goal has never been to be able to run the entire RV on solar. We are not boondockers but if we ever got caught out or needed to use the RV in an emergency as we did in July when storms took out our house power for over a week, the RV was a life saver so I wanted to be able to do it if I have to. So the goal was to be able to run all the 12V and 120V outlets on the solar. That also includes the outside fridge, (so the beer stays cool on the road).

                              Here is what I ended up with:
                              Click image for larger version

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                              A little explanation is in order.

                              I leveraged the inverter prep (after finding the wires), cutting it and bringing both ends into the ATS. I moved the microwave off the sub panel and moved the converter in its place. Its off as I added the Victron charger so just having a place to sit, its there if i ever need it. So the shore power comes in from the main panel to the ATS and powers the sub panel that now has both set of breakers for all the 120V outlets. If the shore power is pulled then the ATS switches the subpanel to the 1200VA inverter. All outlets and outside fridge stay on. Works as planned. Plug back in and ATS switches all back to the shore power. A little explanation on the 2 sets of outlets on the left. Far left are wired into the sub panel, so shore or inverter are always on. To the right, the outlet is wired to the main panel thru the ATS, so if we lose the shore power then that plug goes dead, and the Victron charger with it so no charging loops. Thats it, seems to all work and have not burned anything up as yet. I have room to add two more batteries which I will in the next few months.

                              I would appreciate any questions or critique from the group that have previously been down this rat hole as while this all works does not mean it cant be ipproved.

                              I must say I love the Victron gear, especially being able to use the VRM thru the Raspberry Pi that you can see in the upper right. I have a full time 12V internet connection in the RV thru cell so I can monitor thru VRM from anywhere. Far as I am concerned worth the price of admission to the Victron world.

                              Thanks to all for the help and looking forward to your feedback. Al
                              Al and Diane

                              2022 28BH - (6) Chins 100AH, MultiPlus 2, (2) 100/30CC, 1.4KW solar
                              RAM 2019 2500 Cummins crew cab short bed
                              PullRite SuperGlide

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                allenrude -- clean installation. It's difficult to make out all the components in the picture, do you have the ability to make a schematic? Reviewing the component selection and how they are all connected will be much easier to digest (for me) looking at a drawing versus text. ( WondersAwait did an excellent job with his schematic if you're looking for an example.)

                                The only suggestion I have for your installation is to fill the rest of that space with more batteries. Looks like you have plenty of space for at least three more. (Having a larger "fuel tank" to extend the length of time power is available a nice thing to have.)

                                Howard
                                Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

                                2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus

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