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  • F250 Payload Discussion


    So I have a 2020 F-250 SD 4WD FX4 XLT CC SB with the 6.7PS, 3.55 e-locker, and the HCTP. (unrelated to this question but for more info, it has the 3" class V travel trailer hitch from factory rated at 21,200/2120)
    It has the M275 rear axle and the 5 rear spring setup. It also has the factory Ford 5th wheel prep package.

    The stickers:
    GVWR - 10,800 (Tennessee rules)
    Rear GAWR - 6,340
    Front GAWR - 5,200
    Factory cargo rating - 2,906
    Factory calculated curb weight - 7,894

    Actual curb weight with full fuel and no passengers (CAT Scale) - 7,780 total, 4,620 steer, 3,160 drive
    Adjusted cargo rating based on real curb weight - 3,020

    It is obvious that there is some significant derating going on here since the F-250 with the HCTP and the F-350 are basically the same truck when it comes to what matters towing a 5th wheel.

    The Rear GAWR for the F-350 is 7,230 for the same axle and spring setup
    The GVWR for the F-350 is 11,500 in the same configuration.

    It appears that the limiter for rear GAWR the F-350 is the same as for the rear GAWR on the F-250 and that is the tire/wheel combo.
    It appears that the limiter for the GVWR on the F-250 vs the F-350 is the artificial limit imposed by the 10,800 GVWR on my truck.
    Using the non-derated numbers of the F-350, then my F-250's payload rating would be ~ 3,720.

    Other notes:
    Tennessee has a max GCWR of 26,000 the truck actual is 30,000
    The max 5th wheel hitch capacity of the Ford 5th wheel prep package is 19,000

    Now that you have all the numbers, can my truck safely tow a Grand Design Reflection 311BHS?
    Brochure numbers:
    UVW = 11,185
    GWVR = 13,995
    Pin weight = 2,197

  • #2
    Hi Brantel, and welcome to the Technical forum. We're glad you could join us.

    One of the biggest "gotchas" is the pin weight. The 2,197 pin weight is with an empty RV. The GVWR of the 311BHS is 13,995. A reasonable pin weight is 20-22% of the GVWR. So I'm guessing the real pin weight of a loaded 311 is going to range between 2,800# and 3,100# depending on how you load it. I used to own a Reflection 337RLS which had the same GVWR as the 311. My pin weight was right around 3,100#.

    So, by the time you add the loaded pin weight, hitch weight, driver and passenger weights, cargo weight, you'll probably be well above 3,600 pounds of cargo for the truck. I know people who tow similar sized FWs with similar trucks with some success. However, since I'm one of the moderators on the site, I really can't give my opinion on whether it's safe or not.

    Maybe others will weigh in with their experiences.

    Jim

    P.S. Since you're brand new to the forum, this link may make your navigation around the site a little easier:
    https://gdrvowners.com/forum/main-fo...to-new-members


    Jim and Ginnie
    2024 Solitude 310GK
    GDRV Technical Forum Moderator
    GDRV Rally Support Coordinator

    Comment


    • #3
      Brantel


      Welcome to our owners technical forum!
      I have edited your post title to something more meaningful than "Can it do it safely" which could have referred to almost anything. We try to use titles the can be found when searching key words.

      Rob
      Cate & Rob
      (with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
      2015 Reflection 303RLS
      2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
      Bayham, Ontario, Canada

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Brantel View Post

        So I have a 2020 F-250 SD 4WD FX4 XLT CC SB with the 6.7PS, 3.55 e-locker, and the HCTP. (unrelated to this question but for more info, it has the 3" class V travel trailer hitch from factory rated at 21,200/2120)
        It has the M275 rear axle and the 5 rear spring setup. It also has the factory Ford 5th wheel prep package.

        The stickers:
        GVWR - 10,800 (Tennessee rules)
        Rear GAWR - 6,340
        Front GAWR - 5,200
        Factory cargo rating - 2,906
        Factory calculated curb weight - 7,894

        Actual curb weight with full fuel and no passengers (CAT Scale) - 7,780 total, 4,620 steer, 3,160 drive
        Adjusted cargo rating based on real curb weight - 3,020

        It is obvious that there is some significant derating going on here since the F-250 with the HCTP and the F-350 are basically the same truck when it comes to what matters towing a 5th wheel.

        The Rear GAWR for the F-350 is 7,230 for the same axle and spring setup
        The GVWR for the F-350 is 11,500 in the same configuration.

        It appears that the limiter for rear GAWR the F-350 is the same as for the rear GAWR on the F-250 and that is the tire/wheel combo.
        It appears that the limiter for the GVWR on the F-250 vs the F-350 is the artificial limit imposed by the 10,800 GVWR on my truck.
        Using the non-derated numbers of the F-350, then my F-250's payload rating would be ~ 3,720.

        Other notes:
        Tennessee has a max GCWR of 26,000 the truck actual is 30,000
        The max 5th wheel hitch capacity of the Ford 5th wheel prep package is 19,000

        Now that you have all the numbers, can my truck safely tow a Grand Design Reflection 311BHS?
        Brochure numbers:
        UVW = 11,185
        GWVR = 13,995
        Pin weight = 2,197
        It is going to ultimately be up to you. Many on here have been in the same boat, and most have had the pleasure of trading in a perfectly good truck, some have even done it twice. Technically letter of the law you’ll be overweight with what the truck is rated for. Will that ever matter? Will you get a ticket or stopped? Probably not. I’ve heard rumors all over the internet that your insurance will not cover you if you’re overweight and in an accident, I personally would be shocked if this was true, but if it was a bad enough accident where someone lost their life... crazier things have happened in a court case.

        For me personally I elected to keep my F250, but when I replaced my truck a year later (looking to move to a newer gen with some new features) I went F350 to be “covered “.

        Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.

        Neil Citro
        2018 Reflection 28BH Pepwave
        2019 F350 6.7L Long Bed Crew Cab

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by ncitro View Post

          It is going to ultimately be up to you. Many on here have been in the same boat, and most have had the pleasure of trading in a perfectly good truck, some have even done it twice. Technically letter of the law you’ll be overweight with what the truck is rated for. Will that ever matter? Will you get a ticket or stopped? Probably not. I’ve heard rumors all over the internet that your insurance will not cover you if you’re overweight and in an accident, I personally would be shocked if this was true, but if it was a bad enough accident where someone lost their life... crazier things have happened in a court case.

          For me personally I elected to keep my F250, but when I replaced my truck a year later (looking to move to a newer gen with some new features) I went F350 to be “covered “.
          This is good advice. I have challenged folks on several forums to document any codes or regulations that involve non-commercial drivers and overweight rigs. No one has ever been able to provide any proof that this refusal of insurance coverage has ever happened. No one has ever been able to show any documents where they received a citation for non-commercial overweight.

          If you are concerned about the actual pin weight you can add air bags to level the truck. The bags will not increase your legal payload but will absolutely provide additional suspension capabilities. Drive the 250 until you decide you want a new truck and then buy the 350 so the Internet weight police will leave you alone.
          2017 310GK

          Comment


          • #6
            Had a 1/2 ton when we made the decision to purchase our 3740BH so upgrading the truck wasn't an option. Doing my research, came up against all the same things being talked about in this forum - the 3/4 ton trucks seem to have the same running gear as the 1 tons, but the specs for GVWR and axle loadings are different and several sources said similar things about warranties, insurance & weight cops. In the end I went with the 1 ton as it eliminated the concern over getting pulled over somewhere in a state where the rules regarding GVWR and axle loading are enforced more stringently or getting into an accident and having an insurance company or lawyer create an issue. (Like JeffC, don't know of any documented cases of either happening, but for me I don't want to be a "test case"!)
            How often you're going to tow and how far should also be part of your considerations - if we were staying somewhat local to a favorite campsite or piece of property we owned within a few hours of home I'd be less concerned than I was because we're planning on longer trips across the western states. Speed is another factor - if you're going to run on highways at 65-70 mph having everything set up correctly is vitally important.
            The air bags JeffC mentioned are a good option even with a 1 ton - besides helping level out the load they also help dampen the ride out if you travel on roadways that "less than perfect".
            Chris
            2019 Solitude 3740BH
            2019 Chevy 3500HD Duramax SRW

            Comment


            • #7
              I can't disagree with your reasoning on the numbers. With the real life pin weight of that rig, you will be up against payload no matter how you figure it. Based on your numbers you would have about 700 lbs for passengers and cargo in the truck. Cutting it close. If it were me, I would opt for a lighter 5th wheel, or get a long bed one ton SRW with a rated payload more like 4500 lbs.
              2020 F-350 CCSB 6.7L Powerstroke
              2020 Imagine 2250rk

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