So not off to a great start… going out to load the camper for our first trip next week, and the battery was dead. It has been parked in covered storage for 12 days with battery disconnect in disconnect position. Currently on charger (was down to 5.7V). What is drawing power in that configuration? And would it be normal to be drawing enough juice to kill the battery that quickly? Called Campers Inn, and was simply told “If you don’t want your battery to die, pull the positive lead.”
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Originally posted by StarlifterFE View PostSo not off to a great start… going out to load the camper for our first trip next week, and the battery was dead. It has been parked in covered storage for 12 days with battery disconnect in disconnect position. Currently on charger (was down to 5.7V). What is drawing power in that configuration? And would it be normal to be drawing enough juice to kill the battery that quickly? Called Campers Inn, and was simply told “If you don’t want your battery to die, pull the positive lead.”
Your Grand Design owners manual (link to electronic versions on menu bar above) states to pull the negative lead on the battery for long term storage. ("Long" is not defined.) Not sure why Campers Inn said to pull the positive. (Either will work in reality, but the negative is better IMHO.)
There are several items in the camper that can draw a battery down even with the battery cutoff set properly. Some newer GD trailers have their refrigerator wired directly to the battery (bypassing the shutoff). Almost every GD trailer has the carbon monoxide and propane detectors hard-wired to the battery. On your new 337RLS there could be even more items.
Anticipating your next question, the reason the battery cutoff doesn't disconnect all power is because that would mean the emergency brakes would not work. Code and liability force GD to wire the campers as they do. Many owners (including myself) have added a second cutoff that actually cuts off all battery power. Since the jacks won't work, the rationale is it would be difficult to drive away with all the stabilizers and front jack still firmly attached to the ground. (A self-correcting oversight!)
Hope that helps (and that you didn't mind the good-natured teasing). Hang in there--lots to learn (and we've all been there).
HowardForum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
Howard & Francine
2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus
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howson Thanks Howard! I can take it... the worst thing is the truck was full of gear, so I didn't even have the tools to pull the battery (be gentle on that one).
Campers Inn service just specified the detectors and the leveling system, but you're probably right. I guess I had "assumed" a disconnect switch meant disconnect.
On a related note, short of going out to the camper every couple days to verify, any idea if the pre-installed solar array will grab enough UV to charge the battery in an outdoor covered spot? I had thought about this before, but thought I was playing it safe by "disconnecting" the battery. I also noticed a note in the manual that says to turn off the controller off before pulling the battery. Of course, I saw this after I pulled the battery, and the manual for the controller doesn't indicate an "off" function even exists.
I don't mind the learning part... I actually enjoy it. I just wish the learning wasn't taking place at the same time as the fixing. My AF training spoiled me! What I learned today was that the carbon monoxide detector low battery beep works... unfortunately, my storage situation means I can't get into the rig while it's parked (space between the units).Rob & Stacy
2020 F-250 7.3 Gasser 4x4 Crew; Reese GooseBox
2022 Reflection 337RLS
Charleston, SC
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Originally posted by StarlifterFE View Posthowson Thanks Howard! I can take it... the worst thing is the truck was full of gear, so I didn't even have the tools to pull the battery (be gentle on that one).
Campers Inn service just specified the detectors and the leveling system, but you're probably right. I guess I had "assumed" a disconnect switch meant disconnect.
On a related note, short of going out to the camper every couple days to verify, any idea if the pre-installed solar array will grab enough UV to charge the battery in an outdoor covered spot? I had thought about this before, but thought I was playing it safe by "disconnecting" the battery. I also noticed a note in the manual that says to turn off the controller off before pulling the battery. Of course, I saw this after I pulled the battery, and the manual for the controller doesn't indicate an "off" function even exists.
Adding a shutoff between the panel(s) and solar controller, and also one between the controller and battery, (if either do not currently exist) are "To Do" items to consider.
My .02 on the battery: disconnect the negative (after ensuring it's fully charged since it is a lead acid) as the last step prior to leaving the camper in storage.
Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
Howard & Francine
2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus
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StarlifterFE ,I don't know the correct answers but can relay my experience with my 2022 with 165w solar panel, and 2 LA batteries installed by the dealer.
Even in full sunshine I have not been able to keep the batteries charged for more than a couple of days. And that was with the battery disconnected (with red disconnect key pulled) amd confirmed 12v fridge turned off. I don't know if there's something wrong with my solar charger or converter but I suspect there's just too much parasitic drain. I'll be disconnecting the negative lead from now on when storing the trailer.
Regards turning the solar charger "off" - Grand Design customer service told me it was OK to disconnect the batteries even though there is no way to turn off the solar charger.Mike and Rebecca
2022 Reflection 150 260RD, October 2021 build date.
2001 Chev 2500 HD 8.1 liter 4x4
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Mike & Rebecca that would be utterly remarkable if the solar setup can’t supply more power than parasitic drain… what exactly is the purpose of the solar then?Rob & Stacy
2020 F-250 7.3 Gasser 4x4 Crew; Reese GooseBox
2022 Reflection 337RLS
Charleston, SC
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Originally posted by howson View Post
Shade kills solar. I'd assume a fully covered spot means no solar input. Check out Shade's Effect on Solar Output here: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/solar/r...n-solar-output
Adding a shutoff between the panel(s) and solar controller, and also one between the controller and battery, (if either do not currently exist) are "To Do" items to consider.
My .02 on the battery: disconnect the negative (after ensuring it's fully charged since it is a lead acid) as the last step prior to leaving the camper in storage.
Rob & Stacy
2020 F-250 7.3 Gasser 4x4 Crew; Reese GooseBox
2022 Reflection 337RLS
Charleston, SC
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Originally posted by StarlifterFE View Post
I’ll have to dig into the stack to read through any documentation to see what’s in the solar setup. What is the benefit of installing shutoffs in those locations? I wouldn’t be adverse to mods that maximize what I have, but if the solar can’t even keep the batteries charged in full sun (as mike & Rebecca described) I wouldn’t want to just throw time and money away. Installing the Progressive EMS is first on the list, once I find the video I had and determine whether the 6ga wiring need to be stranded, or solid copper, or if it matters.
A hardwired EMS was also one of my very first mods back in Jul '18. The cabinet and wire run in your 337 is very similar to my 315RLTS. If it helps, I documented my install here: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/operati...a-2019-315rlts
If you haven't seen it yet, there's a spreadsheet that keeps an (almost) comprehensive list of the mods done by members of this forum. You'll find it in the Modifications channel. It will give you tons of ideas on what you can do to your camper. https://gdrvowners.com/modifications
Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
Howard & Francine
2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus
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Mike & Rebecca StarlifterFE howson Does the factory solar charge the batteries with the disconnect off (red key pulled)? I wouldn't expect it to.
FWIW, our Solitude has 300 watts of factory solar feeding 320 amp hours of lifeline AGM batteries. Unit has a residential frig, and 2000 watt inverter. Just dry camped for three days in full sun (when it was up, lol) in Central CA, daytime temps near 70. Ran the onboard generator 3 hours each evening. No one in the unit all day; everything except frig was off. After three days, batteries were down to 12.5 volts.
If we were seriously into dry camping, we would have to significantly upgrade our panels, or run the generator far more, or both. I provide this info so you can kind of see that the solar is not the end all, cure all for the RV battery system without significant upgrades and $$.
Starlifter, If I were in your spot, I would be looking for the largest capacity battery(s) that would fit your available space (as a start), then physically disconnect them while in storage.Dave and Darren Bakersfield, CA
2019 GMC Denali dually 4x4 duramax, BW puck hitch, timbrens
2015 Chevrolet 3500 CC duramax SB SRW (much loved; replaced with dually)
2021 Solitude 390 RK-R (3 A/C, solar, gen, 8K axles DP glass), comfort ride shocks, VIN 03584
Max and Riley, our chihuahua/jack russell furbabies
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Originally posted by DarnDave View PostMike & Rebecca StarlifterFE howson Does the factory solar charge the batteries with the disconnect off (red key pulled)? I wouldn't expect it to.
FWIW, our Solitude has 300 watts of factory solar feeding 320 amp hours of lifeline AGM batteries. Unit has a residential frig, and 2000 watt inverter. Just dry camped for three days in full sun (when it was up, lol) in Central CA, daytime temps near 70. Ran the onboard generator 3 hours each evening. No one in the unit all day; everything except frig was off. After three days, batteries were down to 12.5 volts.
If we were seriously into dry camping, we would have to significantly upgrade our panels, or run the generator far more, or both. I provide this info so you can kind of see that the solar is not the end all, cure all for the RV battery system without significant upgrades and $$.
Starlifter, If I were in your spot, I would be looking for the largest capacity battery(s) that would fit your available space (as a start), then physically disconnect them while in storage.
Since boondocking isn’t in the plans for the near future, we’ll prob just figure out how to add another battery, and upgrade from the lead acids… I’ll do a forum search and see what if I can find a cost-effective solution that will meet our needs. For start, I’ll be adding a true disconnect, since the solar isn’t any help in a covered lot.
Rob & Stacy
2020 F-250 7.3 Gasser 4x4 Crew; Reese GooseBox
2022 Reflection 337RLS
Charleston, SC
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Originally posted by howson View Post
Anticipating your next question, the reason the battery cutoff doesn't disconnect all power is because that would mean the emergency brakes would not work. Code and liability force GD to wire the campers as they do.
Starlifter is by no means the first person to discover this the hard way. And there lots more "my battery is dead" threads coming. It seems like a trap for new owners and the purpose of it escapes me.
2018 Dodge 3500 6.7 Cummins w Aisin and 9 cup holders
2021 303RLS
Electricians were created because engineers need heroes too...
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Originally posted by Scott'n'Wendy View PostHow about one more question. What is the purpose of a battery disconnect...that doesn't disconnect the battery? Why have it at all?
Starlifter is by no means the first person to discover this the hard way. And there lots more "my battery is dead" threads coming. It seems like a trap for new owners and the purpose of it escapes me.
A speculation (I could be completely wrong): battery disconnects started out years ago as just that--battery disconnects. Over time, as accidents happened, standards were created in an attempt to negate a repeat of the event.
In some cases it's not even an accident that drives an OEM to bypass the disconnect. GD purposefully bypassed the battery disconnect (at least they did on early installations) on 12v refrigerators. I believe the intent was to keep owners from inadvertently shutting the appliance off. We've certainly read many, many threads where that happened ("bumped the key in the passthru").
Killing batteries due to the parasitic drain could be considered an unfortunate unintended consequence.
Last edited by howson; 02-20-2022, 12:04 PM.Forum moderators are not GD employees--we are volunteers and owners presumably just like yourself. Unless specifically mentioned otherwise, we have nothing to gain should you choose to purchase a product or engage a service we discuss on this forum.
Howard & Francine
2017 Ford F-350 DRW, '19 315RLTSPlus
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Originally posted by howson View Post
In some cases it's not even an accident that drives an OEM to bypass the disconnect. GD purposefully bypassed the battery disconnect (at least they did on early installations) on 12v refrigerators. I believe the intent was to keep owners from inadvertently shutting the appliance off. We've certainly read many, many threads where that happened ("bumped the key in the passthru").
Killing batteries due to the parasitic drain could be considered an unfortunate unintended consequence.Rob & Stacy
2020 F-250 7.3 Gasser 4x4 Crew; Reese GooseBox
2022 Reflection 337RLS
Charleston, SC
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Originally posted by Scott'n'Wendy View PostHow about one more question. What is the purpose of a battery disconnect...that doesn't disconnect the battery? Why have it at all?
Starlifter is by no means the first person to discover this the hard way. And there lots more "my battery is dead" threads coming. It seems like a trap for new owners and the purpose of it escapes me.
RobCate & Rob
(with Border Collies Molly & Angel + Kitties Hazel & Elsie)
2015 Reflection 303RLS
2022 F350 Diesel CC SB SRW Lariat
Bayham, Ontario, Canada
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