Thinking about upgrading my factory solar system

[bertschb]

Heal quickly, Brian!

FYI, our systems appear to perform about the same. Awesome, isn't it?

Thanks Howard. Yes, it is awesome! In order to reduce propane consumption, I ran the fireplace for a couple hours this morning. That dropped the batteries down to around 41%. I'll see how quickly the batteries recharge this afternoon. If they recharge quickly, I'll use the fireplace more often.

[howson]

Time for another pain pill

Heal quickly, Brian!

FYI, our systems appear to perform about the same. Awesome, isn't it?

I also run the water heater on propane, but only run the heater when hot water is needed.

The shortfall to our setups is definitely when air conditioning is required.

[bertschb]

Update:

I just wanted to update you guys on my new solar system. It has worked flawlessly since installation about a month ago. I got my right knee replaced on Wednesday and to prepare for that, my sister in law invited us to park at their place in La Pine, OR so my wife would have some support if needed. They have full hookups but I told them I wanted to see if my new solar system would work well enough to stay unplugged for the full 5-6 weeks we plan to stay here. It has only been five days since we arrived but the lowest my batteries have dropped to was about 65% overnight. It isn't hot enough here to need air conditioning but we run whatever we want in the RV. The only concession I make is to run the water heater from propane.

The highest output I've seen from my panels so far is just under 1,300 watts but we haven't had a bright sunny day yet. The next three days are supposed to be sunny so it will be interesting to see if output goes above 1,300 watts. My array is 1,460 watts. My panels are not tilted.

While recuperating, I stare at my Victron VRM Online Portal to see how the system is performing. It's amazing to me how much amperage the system puts out just from a few solar panels.

Time for another pain pill

[bertschb]

Dang...that would tempt me to upgrade. Please keep me informed, Brian.

I'll have my eyes peeled for firmware updates and will share if I see something Howard.

[howson]

That's it exactly. But we’re still looking to improve that; and most likely we’ll be able to make it show data for L2 as well, with a firmware update. If you ask me again in 4 weeks, I’ll know more!" Sooooo, it appears we may get a firmware update down the road that will show loads from both legs which would be awesome!

Dang...that would tempt me to upgrade. Please keep me informed, Brian.

[ncitro]

As mentioned in a previous post, Victron Connect only shows loads on one leg with the new Multiplus II 2x120. I asked for more details on this in the Victron Community forum and got these two replies.

First from another user:
"I believe the Multiplus II 2x120 only monitors power on the L1 side so its only seeing half of the RV "L1" loads when the the RV is powered by 120/240 "Split phase" sources like a 50 amp pedestal connection. It bypasses the L2 straight through to the RV."

Then from a Victron employee commenting on the post above:
"That's it exactly. But we’re still looking to improve that; and most likely we’ll be able to make it show data for L2 as well, with a firmware update. If you ask me again in 4 weeks, I’ll know more!"

Sooooo, it appears we may get a firmware update down the road that will show loads from both legs which would be awesome!

That is encouraging for sure. I could see a firmware update to show the draw on L2, that should be pretty straightforward to calculate and display. Great news!

[bertschb]

bertschb -- can the new Multiplus show the loads on the two phases, a single, or combined? The image in the last post look just like mine (which is a single phase Multiplus).

As mentioned in a previous post, Victron Connect only shows loads on one leg with the new Multiplus II 2x120. I asked for more details on this in the Victron Community forum and got these two replies.

First from another user:
"I believe the Multiplus II 2x120 only monitors power on the L1 side so its only seeing half of the RV "L1" loads when the the RV is powered by 120/240 "Split phase" sources like a 50 amp pedestal connection. It bypasses the L2 straight through to the RV."

Then from a Victron employee commenting on the post above:
"That's it exactly. But we’re still looking to improve that; and most likely we’ll be able to make it show data for L2 as well, with a firmware update. If you ask me again in 4 weeks, I’ll know more!"

Sooooo, it appears we may get a firmware update down the road that will show loads from both legs which would be awesome!

[bertschb]

One issue to remember: it is very easy to inadvertently overload the inverter and drain the batteries.

That's a good reminder Howard. The good news is we're heading back to Oregon soon where A/C won't be needed until August :-)

I did read your overload thread but I'll read it again for a refresher. It will probably make more sense now. I need to look at my power needs differently now and adjust accordingly. May switch to propane for the water heater and I'll definitely need to be careful with high electrical loads while inverting.

I still have some configuration work to do. I imagine there is some way in Victron Connect to get notified of alerts via text or email. I haven't looked into that yet. That would help with the scenario you described.

Getting closer...

[howson]

bertschb -- it will be priceless when they shut off power and you're still able to stay comfortable.

One issue to remember: it is very easy to inadvertently overload the inverter and drain the batteries. For example, you have both air conditioners humming on shore power and the water heater on (120vAC). You leave the camper for a walk around the park and don't realize shore power dropped for whatever reason. Your inverter will do it's best to keep powering everything demanding power--sending the inverter into an overload / reset / overload cycle.

It can even happen when you're in the camper since the Multiplus is so fast to switch over to the inverter you may not even notice until you hear beeping and wonder, "What's that?".

If you haven't read my overload thread, now's a good time to read it (or read it again) as it will likely make more sense to you.

Your setup looks excellent, Brian. I always cringe when I see unprotected positive posts--yours looks neat, tidy, and protected. Well done!

Howard

[bertschb]

Some random observations from testing my system today...

I charged the batteries up, shut off shore power and started the front A/C at 11:00AM. The sky was high overcast and partly cloudy when I started. I ran the A/C for two hours and the batteries were at 65%. By then solar had dropped to about 600w. The most I got was about 1,000w. Soooooo, I can easily run the A/C for 4-5 hours which is better than I expected. The battery cables were pretty warm after two hours but not hot. It definitely gave the entire system a good workout.

I then shut off the A/C, turned shore power back on then turned the A/C back on. It took 95 minutes to fully charge the batteries. Again, that's better than I expected.

So far I'm super impressed with the system and I STILL haven't burned the RV down or made any mistakes. Once again, I thank all you folks here on the forum who offered advice along the way.

We've been stationary here in Palm Springs since September but plan to leave here in a week or two. When we return this fall I plan to use my solar system exclusively for power during the winter. Electricity is VERY expensive here so it will be nice to reduce the electric bill. Of course, they still charge you even with the power shut off but at least the bill will be lower. At a cost of about $13,000, I figure it will only take about 30 years to break even on my upgraded solar system

[ncitro]

Really clean that looks great. I’m glad you like it, I think the thing is just a beast. It’ll run either my of Coleman or Dometic AC units on high with no easy start installed. It’s amazing.

[bertschb]

Not quite done cleaning up the wiring but here is my new system:

[bertschb]

ncitro -- I thought the cool thing about this new Multiplus was PowerAssist was available to both legs?

The cool thing for me Howard is the ability to power both legs while inverting. No need for a manual switch or the AM Solar Smart Phase Selector. Although I need to monitor what I run while inverting, as far as I can tell so far, everything in my RV now has power while on the inverter. That is a HUGE deal to me. PowerAssist would just be a bonus.

[bertschb]

I would bet that means the UI is only going to report the shore power for L1. If you unplug though, it will invert for both lines (as they are then tied together), and the UI for AC loads will show correctly.

I think you're right. I unplugged shore power this morning to test the inverter. Each time I added a load, the UI appeared to report it correctly.

BTW, I'm very impressed with the inverter so far. I was running the following this morning from the inverter:
Clothes dryer
Hair dryer for ten minutes (wifey)
Two modems and routers
TV
Soundbar
Coffee machine (on but idle)
Two laptops

UI showed the AC load at about 2,950 watts.

The funny thing is I told my wife what was running and I thought she just had the washing machine running but she said it was in dryer mode! I just tried the 15k A/C on High/Auto and it only drew 900 watts or something like that. I unplugged the cable from the SmartShunt to the battery so it reset my battery capacity back to 100% (I think it's closer to 90%). Once the battery gets fully charged I'll see how long I can run the A/C.

[wygieman]

Yeah I’m just kind of guessing because the book does not talk about the CCGX integration. What it looks like the intent is, is pass through of both legs, and inverting of both legs. This would remove the need for the smart phase selector, or manual selector switch. But yeah, power assist on L1 only is kind of a bummer. I agree it would also be nice to see the power draw of both phases.

Below are the relevant sections of the manual I saw.

I think part of the question is whether the power assist is based on the total amp draw or just the phase it is displaying. I originally got a GoPower 2000 because it would pass through both phases. It would only power assist on the amp draw of phase 1 so it was only marginally useful. I made a crossover connector that acted like a 30 amp power adapter to get the entire load on phase 1 so that I could use my small honda genset. When I switched to a Magnum, I went one phase and switched the circuits so the ones I wanted to invert were on 1 phase - on my rig it was a 1 wire change. Hopefully the Victron has done it better.