GDRV Technical Visit - Soliciting Feedback From Our Members

[d2reid]

Last minute entry.... Please have a short conversation with them about suspension systems. Broken spring hangers, broken springs, and even broken axles. I know it's a tough subject. On the one hand you have the mathematics, (example only) a 15000 lb max gross weight trailer, 2 7000 pound axles (springs, hubs, bearings) and tongue weight. Should be a no brainer, so why is stuff breaking?

A big part of the problem is our road system. In many places it's not just bad it's horrible. Pot holes 18" across and 12" deep, dips that will make a vehicle jump. Denver was really bad around the construction areas. Salt Lake City has one section of I-80 that I slow down to 45 on, and that's just to drive my truck through it. I avoid that section of road while towing. The famous I-10 bumps in Louisiana. It's all over.

And of course the ignorant consumer. I had a short conversation yesterday with a Momentum owner. He was unhappy with his Momentum, he had a broken spring and asked is I had upgraded my springs on my Momentum. I told him yes, then being curious asked him some questions; has he weighed his trailer; what is he carrying; does he boondock where there are rough roads; how fast does he drive. I got nothing but bad answers, meaning he abuses his suspension system, of course it's going to break.

I know it's tough to build an RV with an excellent price point vs quality, but perhaps they would consider beefing up and reinforcing the suspension systems. Shouldn't be that much more expensive and it would offset the damage done by our poorly maintained roadways.

[TedS]

This may be late to the party. Make the 5th wheel portion longer for more clearance between the truck and trailer. At least enough to allow opening the front storage door for access to that compartment when hitched. I used to be able to more easily walk between truck and trailer years ago.

[KamFlyer]

I mentioned this at one of the rally's, but one thing that would be very helpful is a central repository of GD approved service documents and videos for as many of the major components as possible.
Things like appliances that need regular maintenance, seals, slides, roof, etc. Yes, there are numerous videos on you-tube but quite a few of them contain questionable information or are just badly done.
A GD controlled central repository would very much simply things when one needs to go looking for how to do something.
My $0.02
Thanks for doing this BTW.
-Rob-

[TedS]

I mentioned this at one of the rally's, but one thing that would be very helpful is a central repository of GD approved service documents and videos for as many of the major components as possible.
Things like appliances that need regular maintenance, seals, slides, roof, etc. Yes, there are numerous videos on you-tube but quite a few of them contain questionable information or are just badly done.
A GD controlled central repository would very much simply things when one needs to go looking for how to do something.
My $0.02
Thanks for doing this BTW.
-Rob-

Imagine how good this would be for feedback for designers to design for maintenance.

[Jlawles2]

TedS How good would it be for designers to 1 - work the floor for a few weeks after a new design comes out, and 2 - work dealership tech calls for a couple of months with travel to help repair the issues. This would go a long way in terms of designing for maintenance. Most designers looks touch with repair after the build and forget how hard it is to reach some of the little things that are important.

I know GD will never go all PEX, but just getting all of the fixtures over to PEX would do wonders, also the couple of places where PEX is not easily used (like the pump) using quality double female hoses such as Rob did would help also as they are "easy" to obtain when in a pinch.

[TedS]

Designed for maintenance could give GD a leg up in the very crowded, competitive rv market. Marketing, market share, $$$.

[TedS]

In a former life, the company I worked for farmed out the making of wire harnesses to a company that hired disabled employees to assemble wire harnesses.

[Jlawles2]

In a former life, the company I worked for farmed out the making of wire harnesses to a company that hired disabled employees to assemble wire harnesses.

That would be a great thing along with plumbing. If they could sub contract a standard wiring harness and plumbing layout to a company that uses disabled or veteran or a combination of both, now that would be a selling point.

I was looking behind the nautilus panel and don't see why that can't be all PEX like the B&B manual shows. Subcontracting that would give them the opportunity to make such minor changes.

[Cate&Rob]

Jlawles2 TedS

You are "preaching to the choir" on this forum WRT all Pex plumbing and prefabricated wiring harnesses. Many of us come from industries that use these concepts to improve the manufacturing of their products. With the price of copper wiring, Grand Design could pay for the manufacture of fitted wiring harnesses with the cost savings from using significantly less wire. You can be assured that these ideas have been suggested in face-to-face meetings with Grand Design in the past. They don't see the benefits. The towable RV business is stuck in a 1970's mind set. They have no incentive to change their processes. If you think about the auto industry, it took outside competition bringing a better quality product to the North American customers, to force change in Detroit. Unless an RV manufacturer from somewhere other than Indiana brings a better quality, better price product into the market . . . nothing in this industry is going to change.

Rob

[Guest]

Rob,

Since foreign Automakers have set up camp here, it would benefit them to also come here to build RVs. Most people would pay more for quality additions such as a dedicated wiring harness, torsion suspension, Aluminum roof skin, Azdel wall panels, Endurance tires and more. Also the drop in warranty claims should help to cover the cost of these items. Perhaps the RV industry does not want these rigs to last too long. The was the mindset of the 70s as well.
GM has rigs from Europe on site at the proving grounds and while they are more utilitarian with loads of Formica, the quality looks to be there. Also interesting that they all use surge brakes.

Jim

[Cate&Rob]

Guest
Hi Jim,

While it seems like this would be a viable business plan (to technical folks like us) . . . no one with the deep pockets to take on a venture such as this, seems willing to give it a try. Independent RV manufacturers have tried to make a go of it in other locations, even in Canada, but have not been able to compete with the high volume low cost manufacturers in Indiana.

Rob

[Guest]

Guest
Hi Jim,

While it seems like this would be a viable business plan (to technical folks like us) . . . no one with the deep pockets to take on a venture such as this, seems willing to give it a try. Independent RV manufacturers have tried to make a go of it in other locations, even in Canada, but have not been able to compete with the high volume low cost manufacturers in Indiana.

Rob

I could see that as well. Most likely GDRV sells rigs 10:1 over airstream. When will someone built a rectangular rig with semi airstream construction? Drop the internal skin to save on cost and use typical construction methods for insulation and inside panels. Aluminum box trailers are cheap, and last forever. Aircraft style rivets could make them attractive with painted exteriors.

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catal...yABEgKBmPD_BwE

Jim

[Farklepilot]

How about venting extractor fans to the outside?

[flyfshrockies]

TucsonJim Knowing there is lots to sort out I think many of us are waiting with baited breath for your report on the GD site visit.

Thanks,

Dave

[TucsonJim]

Hi all. I'll be flying home tomorrow and I'll report back by the end of the week. GDRV was very thankful for your input. In fact we will be using forum inputs frequently for reporting to the company.