Water pump leak

[BobinICT]

History. Never had a problem with the OEM pump but choose to replace it when we had the rig re-plumbed last year to pex. Installed/replaced with SeaFlow pump. A few weeks later the pump started leaking from, the top, where the solenoid mounts. Tried applying torque to the screws on top, no difference. Still leaked off and on. Bought a replacement, LCI Flow Max in case we had a failure for replacement until we got home from the winter trip this year.

Replaced pump, tossed the SeaFlow. Two nights into our four night shakedown this weekend to test the mods and other items done this year and, water alarm goes off. Luckily the access panel I installed kept me from having to unscrew the whole panel and remove. Leaking in the same place, off the top.

Wife told me the only thing that changed was she turned on the water heater, electric. So, release pressure to the system and leak stops. Now, on to process of elimination. Let tank cool, heat with gas, same thing.. I now have a bedpan, actually, a bowl sitting under the pump to catch water.

Back home now, read up on needing to have that water heater bubble in there. Completed that. Opened and closed the pressure relief valve a few times when I did the bubble thing. Turn on water heater this morning, same thing, leaking from the top. No drips from the relief valve.

At this point I'm at a loss. I don't want to have to deal with a leak and bedpan for our upcoming winter trip and I want to get this resolved. For what its worth, we almost always use our water using the pump. Just don't like having outside water pressure constantly on, we fill as needed through the city water fill.

Any ideas please? We leave in four weeks for the winter.

[howson]

BobinICT

Can you post a few pics of the issue? Hard to believe two separate pumps (and different makes/models!) have the same failure mode.

[BobinICT]

BobinICT

Can you post a few pics of the issue? Hard to believe two separate pumps (and different makes/models!) have the same failure mode.

It may be a few hours as I need to allow the water to cool, or drain the tank, and then turn on the water heater process. It ONLY apparently happens when we first initiate the heating of the tank. Since this morning and posting this, there has been no additional leakage with the heating element on after opening hot and cold water handles in the bath . I did also check water temp just in case there may have been an over heating issue. Temp at 136 degrees.

[Cate&Rob]

Is the source of the leak somewhere above the pump? Such that the water appears to be leaking from the pump. Water pressure in a closed system rises dramatically when the water heater is turned on. This could be causing a fitting to leak, that otherwise does not.

Rob

[Jkwilson]

Any chance the Pex is apply torque to the pump contributing to the leak? Since the Pex is less flexible, it’s not ideal in a few applications.

[BobinICT]

howson OK, confirmed tank bubble still there. Purged hot water out via the bay shower/water hose connection. Turned on elec and gas to get it going. 14 minutes the seeping started and water alarm went off a minute later.

Nothing above the pump. Photos attached. Photo 5 is the start of the leak.

[TedS]

Take the pump loose and move it to see if the leak follows the pump or not. If the leak does not follow the pump, it's not the pump leaking.

[howson]

BobinICT -- I'll leave the verdict to Cate&Rob so while the following may be interesting wait for his input!

I still find it incredulous that two pumps of different makes and models are exhibiting the same symptom--though I'm tempted to say the pump is bad it's very hard to believe.

What I suspect Rob's going to suggest (since he's made the recommendation about a thousand times in various threads that I've followed for years!) is to insert a pressure gauge into a cold water line to figure out what is going on. I'd (and I'm betting he will, too!) like to know what the water pressure is on the pump's check valve (or internal diaphrams as TedS pointed out). It should be easy to rig up a tester with a gauge from a big box store and a few connectors so the gauge can be inserted between the pump output and the cold water line. (The pump's outlet is normally where the city water cold is feeding back to and exerting pressure on the output side.)

[BobinICT]

TedS It is for sure the top of the pump, nothing else above that pump, nothing. As for taking it loose and moving it around, I just don't see how that is possible. On an additional note, once I open a hot water line the leaking stops, just like that, none, no more. Oh, and, I did check tightness of the screws on top before I did this last run.

I still have the OEM pump. I am thinking of installing it and see what happens since I never had this problem with a pump until I decided to replace it knowing the OEM's tend to fail. Just tried to get ahead of the game. Apparently that it not working out so well.

As for installing a pressure gauge, not much room to work with in there and I prefer not to compromise the existing plumbing connections right now.

Other than dealing with water slopping and cleanup swapping pumps, the swap will be pretty easy as I installed blade connectors for the electrical connections.

Hopefully someone will come along with a solution negating the swap. My back suffers with all the bending down getting into the pass through and I prefer to avoid it if I can.

[howson]

BobinICT -- out of curiosity, run the hot water for a minute or two unit you're sure it's as hot as it gets. Then fill up a cup and toss in a meat thermometer. What's the temperature?

[TedS]

BobinICT, from the LCI installation manual.



It also recommends mounting pump head down so as not to get the motor wet in the event of a leak.

[BobinICT]

BobinICT -- out of curiosity, run the hot water for a minute or two unit you're sure it's as hot as it gets. Then fill up a cup and toss in a meat thermometer. What's the temperature?

Posted that already, 136 degrees

[howson]

Posted that already, 136 degrees

Missed it (sorry). Ok, there goes that theory. 140 is normal so nothing wrong with the water heater.

[Cate&Rob]

As howsonHoward mentioned . . . I am a big proponent of a system pressure gauge to help you see what is going on. This gauge can be anywhere in the cold water system. You can even (temporarily) attach a gauge to the cold water low point drain. If the leak appears as system pressure builds, this may be the reason. The air space in the water heater is there to absorb the water volume expansion with heating. If you have established this space correctly, the system pressure should not climb significantly . . . the only way to know this for sure is with a pressure gauge.

Rob

[TedS]

BobinICT, when you vented the waterheater through the temp-pressure relief valve to reestablish the air pocket did you disconnect or turn off the city water feed so that only excess water in the heater came out?