Fuse Location?

[howson]

Just a bit of speculation, but based on a previous post in https://gdrvowners.com/forum/interio...n-imagine-2600 (#19), photos from Guest tracing the wires from the Furrion connection, I think this was installed without an inline fuse.

Thanks--somehow I'd missed that we've been through most of this already. I read through that thread and do not see a specific reference to a fuse. Guest -- when you did your "deep dive" into this area did you see a fuse on the Furrion wiring?

And FYI for everyone reading this thread, Running from Gnats is correct to be looking for that fuse. According to Furrion's instructions, there *should* be a 10A fuse in the wiring. At least according to Furrion's 95W Solar Panel instructions (found here: https://cdn.accentuate.io/1906129076...SPP95SA-BL.pdf)

[Guest]

Howard,

From the frame picture and the picture from behind the docking station, there is a white wire with a red stripe present. This wire passes overhead from the area of the front cap to the docking station, then under the rig and over to the power side of the breaker. I did not see a fuse but I also did not pull the solar charge plug to see what was behind it.

I own a furrion suitcase solar panel and there is no fuse present there as well.

Jim

[GDRV-Megan]

I have an email into our Imagine production manager, product manager, and engineer. I'll get some info and pass it along.

howson Running from Gnats

[GDRV-Megan]

Running from Gnats

The answer I got from Furrion was that the plant may use different locations, so it will be difficult to know for sure without talking with the person who installs them. Our production is suspended currently, due to the COVID-19 virus. According to Furrion, they require a 10 amp DC fuse to be 5' from the positive battery post:









"Some OEMs include a set of 3 DC fuses on the lower bar of the chassis outside of the unit right underneath the inlet. The only other place I have seen a DC fuse for this application is right next to the battery or inside of a front storage compartment tide into a larger DC disconnect switch. It is possible that some plants are not installing fuses for this system as it is only typically a max 5.6 AMP PV load. However, the point of the fuse is more to protect the battery and other devices from the short circuit for instances if something were to go wrong with the AM PWM controller."

Once we go back online, we can verify exactly how the Imagine line is running this and I can get back with you.

[Running from Gnats]

Running from Gnats

The answer I got from Furrion was that the plant may use different locations, so it will be difficult to know for sure without talking with the person who installs them. Our production is suspended currently, due to the COVID-19 virus. According to Furrion, they require a 10 amp DC fuse to be 5' from the positive battery post:









"Some OEMs include a set of 3 DC fuses on the lower bar of the chassis outside of the unit right underneath the inlet. The only other place I have seen a DC fuse for this application is right next to the battery or inside of a front storage compartment tide into a larger DC disconnect switch. It is possible that some plants are not installing fuses for this system as it is only typically a max 5.6 AMP PV load. However, the point of the fuse is more to protect the battery and other devices from the short circuit for instances if something were to go wrong with the AM PWM controller."

Once we go back online, we can verify exactly how the Imagine line is running this and I can get back with you.

Thanks for working on this for me (and others). I've looked over the information and photos you provided and there is no fusing except the 30 amp circuit breaker within 5 feet of the battery. If there is one upstream (towards the driver side Furrion plug) it's unreachable if placed behind the front basement wall.

The only way to locate anything behind the front basement wall is to remove it. If there is a fuse behind it, and given this is a 6 month old trailer, I gather due to placement by the factory, access and replacement is a warranty issue. And if the fuse is in an non-accessible area, isn't this a design issue and subject to recall? Placing a fuse where there is no access is a safety issue as well as making the feature basically unusable if the fuse blows.

Also, the Furrion plug on my unit is mounted on wall near the nose of the trailer, not on the frame. I don't know if that makes any difference in how (and where) it might be fused.


I have spoken with several solar cell providers and the wiring used in the trailer (from what I can see through physically tracking) is the same gauge as they use in their 20 amp PWM controllers. The output of the Renogy solar suitcase package I want to use is about 11.66 amps. In researching the Furrion solar cells, their output is about half of that (and double the price). Furrion's wiring off the plug and the wiring installed by GD is more than capable to handle an 11 amp load (though that's the max I would want to use it for).

Hopefully your resources will respond in the very near future as I want to test out the system and make sure everything is working prior to a planned summer boondocking trip.

Norris

[Country Campers]

Running from Gnats

Can you determine that the wires from the Furrion plug goes to the circuit breaker? Pull on one end and see the other end move. If yes you could cut the wire at the butt connector , tape a string or another wire to it and pull it the whole way thru and see if there is a fuse in the line. With the string or wire attached you can pull the wire back thru to the original position. If there is no fuse in line then just add one where you cut the wire.

Brian

[howson]

Running from Gnats

Can you determine that the wires from the Furrion plug goes to the circuit breaker? Pull on one end and see the other end move. If yes you could cut the wire at the butt connector , tape a string or another wire to it and pull it the whole way thru and see if there is a fuse in the line. With the string or wire attached you can pull the wire back thru to the original position. If there is no fuse in line then just add one where you cut the wire.

Brian

Running from Gnats -- be aware that the "pwr" side of the circuit breaker has +12v on it from the battery. Should you start messing in this area with the wiring, disconnect the negative from your battery FIRST. Using the camper's "Disconnect" will not provide the same level of safety--that c/b will still have power applied (wire from the + side of the battery goes right to the gold side of that c/b).

[Running from Gnats]

Running from Gnats

Can you determine that the wires from the Furrion plug goes to the circuit breaker? Pull on one end and see the other end move. If yes you could cut the wire at the butt connector , tape a string or another wire to it and pull it the whole way thru and see if there is a fuse in the line. With the string or wire attached you can pull the wire back thru to the original position. If there is no fuse in line then just add one where you cut the wire.

Brian

Unfortunately trying to pull the wire to see if the other end moves won't work since the wires we are talking about are tied to a stud before they go into a conduit on the plug end (I know that from trying to pull all the wiring I could at the plug and then verifying with an endoscope by visually seeing the tie down, which is out of reach behind the front wall).

After your suggestion, I did put a toner onto the positive port on the plug and it does tone on the load side of the c/b. However the tone would go through a cable even if it has an inline fuse, so I still don't know if there is a fuse between.

And Howard thanks for the reminder to disconnect the negative cable. Did that prior to running the tone tool.

[Running from Gnats]

Thanks--somehow I'd missed that we've been through most of this already. I read through that thread and do not see a specific reference to a fuse. Guest -- when you did your "deep dive" into this area did you see a fuse on the Furrion wiring?

And FYI for everyone reading this thread, Running from Gnats is correct to be looking for that fuse. According to Furrion's instructions, there *should* be a 10A fuse in the wiring. At least according to Furrion's 95W Solar Panel instructions (found here: https://cdn.accentuate.io/1906129076...SPP95SA-BL.pdf)

Just went out to the shed and pulled out the Renogy suitcase. There is a 10 amp fuse inline on their cable. However, the 200W unit I have will put out 11.4 amps under good conditions, so if it blows, I can change it out. Other users who have it blow change out to a 15amp (right now I wouldn't do that) but I still need to know if there is an inline in the trailer. Should that one blow, the plug in solar is unusable.

And you gotta love that Furrion drawing----RV or Boat not included

Question, if I had to go directly to the battery with battery clamps, would that cause an issue, especially if hooked to shore or inverter power? My understanding is solar controllers will go into a "top off" mode with lithium if the onboard converter is designed for wet cells. I want to be able to bring the batteries (2X100ah).

Too bad this hasn't been as easy as I had thought.

Norris

[howson]

Just went out to the shed and pulled out the Renogy suitcase.

Which model Renogy? Is this the manual? https://www.renogy.com/content/files...ual%20V1.0.pdf

[Running from Gnats]

It's the 200 watt suitcase SKU: RNG-KIT-STCS200D-VOY20. Renogy is out of stock, but Amazon does have them. The fuse I found is on the battery clamp positive cable, but I'm looking at where I want to put one in conjunction with the Furrion plug. Do you have any thoughts on putting it on the cable running from the MC4 to the plug or fusing behind the plug (at the junction with the wire butts). Either would be accessible and protect the circuit.

I'm leaning towards splicing it on the outside cable since I believe removing and reinstalling the screws for the plug will eventually cause the screws to loose their ability to hold in the fiberglass/foam of the sidewall.

[howson]

Do you have any thoughts...

Me? I wouldn't use the Furrion connection.

Why? Because every connection, solder point, splice, lug, circuit breaker or fuse, and length of wire adds resistance to the overall circuit. Loss in the wiring is the enemy of solar power. (Well, maybe after shade!)

If you watch any of Will Prowse' videos he is a staunch advocate for good wiring. Please watch the one below I linked for you--Will does a much better job of explaining than me!

My .02: the Renogy comes with the wire to connect right to your battery, fused and all, so do it! Just follow the directions in the manual and you'll get the best results from the 200W panels.

The only item you might consider is an MC4 extension cable that you can insert between the panels and the battery connection cable. Again, this introduces the potential for loss (as explained in the manual) but the power cable Renogy provided is only 9.9' long. An extension will give you more options to move the panels to a sunny spot if you're on a particularly shady location.

[Running from Gnats]

Me? I wouldn't use the Furrion connection.

Why? Because every connection, solder point, splice, lug, circuit breaker or fuse, and length of wire adds resistance to the overall circuit. Loss in the wiring is the enemy of solar power. (Well, maybe after shade!)

If you watch any of Will Prowse' videos he is a staunch advocate for good wiring. Please watch the one below I linked for you--Will does a much better job of explaining than me!

My .02: the Renogy comes with the wire to connect right to your battery, fused and all, so do it! Just follow the directions in the manual and you'll get the best results from the 200W panels.

The only item you might consider is an MC4 extension cable that you can insert between the panels and the battery connection cable. Again, this introduces the potential for loss (as explained in the manual) but the power cable Renogy provided is only 9.9' long. An extension will give you more options to move the panels to a sunny spot if you're on a particularly shady location.

Thank for the suggestions. I've put MC4 connectors on the Furrion male plug wiring. As the length of the male plug wiring is about the same as the Renogy supplied battery clamps, that is where I was looking at placing the fusing. I realize there would be some loss in power, which is one of the reasons I'm looking to see if and where there is a fuse hidden somewhere. Hopefully GD will be able to supply an answer soon.

Besides being the easiest way to use the solar, the reason I want to use it the plug would let me keep the battery case locked. 2 lithium batteries would be an easy target, having once had a wet cell swiped at a campground.

Today is a hot, bright sunny day, and I have the batteries in place, wired in parallel, Thought I would set up the solar and use the battery clamps to top out the batteries.

[Running from Gnats]

I hooked the suitcase solar direct to the 2 Lion Energy UT1300 batteries (parallel). About 1/2 in the 10 amp fuse on the positive clamp blew. Obviously this blew when the cells were at mid-day sun and were putting out 11.2 amps when it burned out. This is exactly why I'm trying to find out if there is a fuse in line and, if so, where the factory put it.




Hopefully gdrv-megan will be able to get a reply from engineering and factory one way or another.

[howson]

Running from Gnats -- putting aside the wiring (and possible fuse) in the trailer for a moment, I can't wrap my head around Renogy putting a 10A fuse in their setup for a 200W suitcase that has a 20A solar charger. Especially when the max current on the spec sheet is 10.5A. A 10A fuse just doesn't make sense (to me)--I'd think a 15A fuse would be more appropriate.

I suggest giving Renogy a call and asking them about it.