Furrion Tankless Water Heater - Important: Please Read

[dfleming103]

I have a 2022 303RLS with the tanklss water heater. My temporary solution is to set the Nautilus water valve to by-pass the water heater and drain the heater. Turn the RED valve horizontal, turn off the heater power switch and open the water heater drain valve. (Open the filter, too.) This drains the heater so it won't freeze. Turn the RED valve vertical and turn on the water heater when you want to use it again. It only drains a couple of quarts of water, so it's not a big water loss. While it's inconvenient, it only takes a minute.

Can you tell me the configuration (or post a pic) of the other valves in the nautilus?
Does this still allow use of the cold water side if you are on city water and/or the pump or does it shut down all water flow in camper such as the toilet? As you say, it is inconvenient, but until GD comes up with a solution this would be the best thing to do.

[Diane&Dave]

[PHP] 

[/PHP]Good morning,

New to the GD family, first post although I’ve been reading post to the site for months.

I raised this issue with the dealer and received information indicating that the heater does not need to be winterized below 40 degrees if the furnace is on and keeping the interior warm as seen in the attached screenshots.

[Diane&Dave]

Sorry about that. It posted without the screenshots

[Diane&Dave]

finally got it.

in sent theses screenshots to GD Customer Service and rec the following:
Good Morning David,


Thank you for contacting Grand Design Customer Support.


You were given the correct information everything Beckley’s told you is right.






Thank you,

John Hamilton
Regional Service Manager
Grand Design RV
574-825-9679--Phone
574-825-9249—Fax


This electronic transmission and any documents accompanying this electronic transmission contain confidential information belonging to the sender. This information may be legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on or regarding the contents of this electronically transmitted information is strictly prohibited.


From: David Manning <david2955@msn.com>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2021 6:51 PM
To: Customer Service <customerservice@granddesignrv.com>; Diane Gerrior <dianegerrior@gmail.com>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Tankless water heater use in cold weather



Good evening,
Our sales representative from Beckley’s RV in Thurmond, MD reached out to me my text this morning indicating that a factory representative was at the dealership and asked if my wife and I had any questions/concerns.

I replied that we had a concern about the tankless water heater in temperatures below 40 degrees. Screen shots of the text thread are below:



Please confirm the tankless heater can be used in temperatures below freezing as long as the unit is winterized before the trailer heating system is turned off.

The VIN for our Reflection 367bhs is 573FR4226N9916425.

Thank you for your assistance.

David Manning

---

[hduring]

We opened a case with GD, and received a response yesterday. Since it was concerning the FURRION HWH, the response was not what we expected except that the HWH cannot be used below 39 degrees. Note that we have not heard back from FURRION yet. Response =

From: Daniel Carr <dcarr@granddesignrv.com>
Date: October 14, 2021 at 1:24:56 PM MDT
To: Heinz Duerring <hduring@comcast.net>
Subject: RE: 2021 Grand Design Reflection 337RLS and Furrion Tankless Water Heater - M9913452

Good afternoon!

My apologies for the delay in getting back to you. I only received the notification today.

But I do want to thank you for reaching out to us with your question. We appreciate hearing from our customers.

Yes, the tankless water heater is not designed for temperatures that can reach below 39 degrees. However, the trailer really isn't a "four season" as most customers feel that phrase means. Can it be used in coder temperatures? Yes. Can it be used in temps that get to 32 degrees and below? To a certain extent, yes. Whenever you get in temperatures that reach 32 degrees or below, you run the risk of freeze damage - whether or not the trailer is said to have four season ability. Water freezes at 32 degrees and there is no escaping that. The risk that something may freeze is pertinent even in Class As, Class Cs or any RV. It's nothing that can be escaped or changed. Freeze damage isn't covered by warranty so every precaution must be taken.

For example, if you look on the sidewall of the trailer, you will find a vent for the back of the refrigerator and one for the water heater. These are open to the outside air and there is no way to insulate them from the outside temperatures. Those are exposed to the heat and cold 100% of the time. I wouldn't want to take the chance of damaging either because I'd be the one who had to pay for the replacement(s).

On the flip side of the "four season" statement is the extreme heat. Customers who travel to California, Arizona, Utah, Texas, New Mexico, Florida, etc. can see temperatures exceed well over 100 degrees. The A/C won't be able to keep up with the high heat (especially if the air is humid as well). Can you operate the trailer in excessive heat? Yes. Are you taking a risk being in the heat? Also yes.

There's more to both sides of the coin but I think you get the idea as to what I'm conveying.

I'm happy to discuss the issue further if you'd like or answer any other questions you may have.

Have a great day!

Daniel Carr
Retail Service Manager
Grand Design RV
11356 County Road 2
Middlebury, IN 46540


So, we are still at square 1. We’ll see if FURRION comes through with any heating elements. For now, we’ve winterized our RV (was 29 degrees last night).

[Guest]

Maybe a good ol fashion Atwood option could be had. I believe the Truma has a small tank (think stored energy) and will re-fire occasionally to prevent freezing so the design of this unit was not very well thought out. I often wonder if these folks ever go camping to use the products they design.

Jim

Moderator Note: For discussion on the Truma please see this thread: Truma -- Furrion Tankless Water Heater Option FYI...this post is now the first post in the new thread about the Truma.

[dfleming103]

finally got it.

in sent theses screenshots to GD Customer Service and rec the following:
Good Morning David,


Thank you for contacting Grand Design Customer Support.


You were given the correct information everything Beckley’s told you is right.






Thank you,

John Hamilton
Regional Service Manager
Grand Design RV
574-825-9679--Phone
574-825-9249—Fax


This electronic transmission and any documents accompanying this electronic transmission contain confidential information belonging to the sender. This information may be legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on or regarding the contents of this electronically transmitted information is strictly prohibited.


From: David Manning <david2955@msn.com>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2021 6:51 PM
To: Customer Service <customerservice@granddesignrv.com>; Diane Gerrior <dianegerrior@gmail.com>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Tankless water heater use in cold weather



Good evening,
Our sales representative from Beckley’s RV in Thurmond, MD reached out to me my text this morning indicating that a factory representative was at the dealership and asked if my wife and I had any questions/concerns.

I replied that we had a concern about the tankless water heater in temperatures below 40 degrees. Screen shots of the text thread are below:



Please confirm the tankless heater can be used in temperatures below freezing as long as the unit is winterized before the trailer heating system is turned off.

The VIN for our Reflection 367bhs is 573FR4226N9916425.

Thank you for your assistance.

David Manning

---

Hi David,

The screen shot of your text didn't make it thru, so I'm trying to read between the lines on what was said, It appears that your dealer told you the propane heat system would be enough to keep the tankless heater from freezing, and the GD person agreed? the post right after yours seems to say the exact opposite. Is there anyway you can just type out the message that you are trying to screenshot?
Thanks, this tankless heater freezing is an issue as we frequently go camping at 20 degree over nite temps
Donnie

[Guest]

Yes I can vouch for my Truma, there is a small tank as well as a recirculation pump that comes on the keep that tank at temperature. There is even a mode for freeze protect that runs the pump and keeps the system above freezing.

From what I've seen of the Furrion, regardless of what anyone says I would not use it below 40 degrees (certainly not below freezing) before they have a fix. The furnace running may protect the water lines but i will not help the part of the water heater exposed to the outside by the access door.

I second Neils advice. Do not use the unit below 39F ambient temps until a fix is released. Otherwise if damage occurs, folks will most likely be eating the cost of a replacement unit.

Jim

[Dennis66]

One thing to add there is a drain plug and filter plug to pull when winterizing, I also seen in my manual. Im going to blow out my system including the heater plugs for the tankless system.

[ckreef]

I too am very disappointed with the tankless water heater. What a bad decision GD made.

What I'm about to type I am not recommending but it is what happened.

Last night the outside temperature got down to 33 or 34 degrees. Below the infamous 39 but not actually freezing. We did not run the furnace. We had a space heater in the living area to keep us warm. No heat in the pass through storage area. This morning all is well with the tankless water heater. I figured it was going to be okay since it didn't actually get to freezing temps.

I figure the infamous 39 degrees is their temperature cushion so they don't have to fix warranty claims when somebody camps below freezing. Artic package with the Furrion tankless heater is a joke.

I just need to go another week before winterizing and it's not supposed to get below 40 over the next week.

[hduring]

I too am very disappointed with the tankless water heater. What a bad decision GD made.

What I'm about to type I am not recommending but it is what happened.

Last night the outside temperature got down to 33 or 34 degrees. Below the infamous 39 but not actually freezing. We did not run the furnace. We had a space heater in the living area to keep us warm. No heat in the pass through storage area. This morning all is well with the tankless water heater. I figured it was going to be okay since it didn't actually get to freezing temps.

I figure the infamous 39 degrees is their temperature cushion so they don't have to fix warranty claims when somebody camps below freezing. Artic package with the Furrion tankless heater is a joke.

I just need to go another week before winterizing and it's not supposed to get below 40 over the next week.

Agree with you - GD made a bad decision. When we asked GD about the Furrion tankless water heater cold temp problem, the response was for everything but the water heater (see #35 above). Furrion has never responded to our written letter. We had no plans on camping this fall / winter, but as many know, Colorado temps fluctuate between hot and cold most of the year (and below 39 (or 32) degrees). We hope a fix is forthcoming. Kind of hate putting money into replacing the Furrion TWH with something that would work, but that thought has entered our mind.

[Jlawles2]

hduring I've toyed with, and if it gets to the point where I will be camping in sub freezing temps, adding a small set of lights inside the HWH to keep it above freezing. I think the discharge will need to be blocked to prevent the cold air from blowing through the burner section, but it would be a lot easier to just block the exhaust of the furnace vs having to drain it every night.

[Jlawles2]

OK so the designers at Furrion need to be Coached heavily. Camper sitting at lease, so I figured I'd drain it just in case. Well, the 2 fittings are extremely close together and tucked back in a hole. Need pliers to get both loose (I removed and replaced finger tight a couple of weeks ago). Thinking about cutting a slot in the brass drain plug for a screwdriver (key) since it's almost impossible to get a decent grip on in it's nice little cubby.

[RPAspey]

OK so the designers at Furrion need to be Coached heavily. Camper sitting at lease, so I figured I'd drain it just in case. Well, the 2 fittings are extremely close together and tucked back in a hole. Need pliers to get both loose (I removed and replaced finger tight a couple of weeks ago). Thinking about cutting a slot in the brass drain plug for a screwdriver (key) since it's almost impossible to get a decent grip on in it's nice little cubby.

Like this?

[Jlawles2]

RPAspey Just like that. When the unit gets back home, it's going to get modified. Then a tool will be put in the compartment with it.

Something like this possibly.