Thanks again Keith. Regarding the squat on the truck you noted, I was running the truck in Alternative Trailer Height mode which lowers the rear of the truck by one inch. That was my setup used for the CAT scale data. My thought process was to get the ball on the Andersen Ultimate hitch lower to increase pin weight. It appeared to me the rig was not quite level when running in the normal height mode. I also have the adjustable ball on the Andersen at the lowest position. Our normal truck height seemed to be high and I was attempting to get the rig to be somewhat level, which I assume is what’s desired.

I agree with trying to increase pin weight - would love to get closer to 20%! Prior to my next visit to the CAT scales, I am planning to get as much of the cargo as possible in the most-forward part of the rig and closest to the pin. I have weighed all of our camping stuff including the new king mattress and additional 12V battery and I will have close to 400 lbs of weight in the front portion of the rig. I already had the motorcycle as far forward in the garage as possible, but will remove the saddle bags and top box which will reduce the weight on the rear tire of the bike in the garage by 42 lbs.

Good to hear you do not have issues carrying fresh water. Our ~100 gallon fresh water tank is behind the axles but close to them. I am currently thinking about adding 25 gallons to our fresh water tank prior to visiting the scales. That would be about 200 lbs of water behind the axles and enough to boondock for a night or two perhaps with augmenting the water supply with jugs. I also have about 15 gallons of gasoline / 95 lbs in the 30 gallon tank farther behind the axles.

To reiterate, the fish tailing / sway I noticed in the mirrors was minor. At no time did I ever feel like things were going to get out of control, but again this is all new to me so I wanted to query the forum for input. Really appreciate all of the input on this topic!

Jlawles: The Andersen Ultimate Hitch connects to a gooseneck ball directly over the rear axle. However, the ball that connects to the pin box is 5 1/2” behind the gooseneck ball. See photo. I am not an engineer, but it seems to me the wide frame footprint on the Andersen distributes the weight over a large area of the truck bed. I do have the option to reverse the Andersen interface with the pin box to move the actual pin closer to the rear axle. I don’t see how that would help with pin weight weight or the minor sway I mentioned, but again I am a newbie. The only down side I know of with reversing the pin box interface is the reduction of truck cab to trailer front cap clearance.

Villager Chuck and Vicki, part of loosing front end weight can lead to a bit of instability in the front. While you may not feel it in the steering of the truck, it will manifest itself in the trailer.

Keep the front tires well balanced, keep it aligned, and any parts in the front that are starting to show signs of wear, replace.

Villager, our trucks are pretty much the same in weights. Although I do not have the air system, I make up for that with a Reese hitch, which is about 150 lbs more than the Andersen. Our payload difference is only one pound (mine is 3750). I have the Reese Sidewinder on my 320G, which is close to 150 lbs heavier than the stock. I put 20 gallons of water in my grey tank, and drove 450 miles yesterday, and it was the best towing yet. A small wiggle on the rear of the trailer every so often, but I am not sure if it was more from the road ruts, and had a smoother ride.

I have not weighed my trailer with the water in it yet. Your truck rear axle weight is 120 lbs lighter than mine (6100 lbs), and that would account for my Sidewinder, so with the water, I would think mine is probably another 110 lbs heavier (some water weight is transferred to the trailer axle) with the water, which means I should have roughly 230 lbs more on my rear axle. My front axle actually gained 20 lbs (5140 to 5160) with the trailer attached. Not sure how much of a difference it makes, but you have about 650 lbs more on your trailer axle than I do.

Do you have the puck on the Andersen in the rear position to get the trailer further away from the truck? That would help account for some difference on your front axle. Otherwise, you need to get 250+ lbs more in the front of the trailer. Not sure how that would change your front axle.

I have an Andersen in my garage, and I was going to use it for the weight savings, but the 5% uphill grade of my driveway from the street puts the nose of the trailer to close to my truck when backing in, so I went with the Sidewinder. Kinda glad I did now, as I needed the weight anyway.

What position is the receiver on your king pin? (photo?) Is in the forward position (forward of king pin)? If so that could be the issue putting too much weight aft of the axle center. As you have the Adersen set your weight is 5 1/2 inches aft of the axle as is. While the hitch spreads this out the center of the weight is directly below the ball. Personally I would try flipping it the other way and then carefully checking clearances.

Just a note - I personally don't like the Anderson (I am a retired engineer). Neither GD or Lippert like them and frame warranty is voided in thier use per them (used to be - don't know about now). It also adds additional stress to the king pin due to the connection method. There are also reports of the hitch collapsing under extreme loading (accidents). Do a bit of research. A properly mounted conventional 5th wheel hitch such as B&W might solve your problem. If you have a short bed they make a good manual slider too.

Just my 2 cents worth here.
Keith

Keith: Thank you for your continued input. The red king pin coupler block is installed as recommended in the installation instructions. See photo. The ball socket in the coupler is 4” in front of the king pin. That recommended orientation was confirmed from the various measurements outlined in the instructions. It could be reversed, but again we followed the instructions for the setup.

The four frame struts on the Andersen that attach the upper portion of the hitch to the base are closer to being centered over the rear axle of the truck. I was thinking that design combined with the direct connection to the goose neck ball directly over the axle would position the weight of the king pin appropriately over the rear axle. Perhaps that’s not the case.

I was aware that many people don’t like the Andersen hitch for the various reasons you cited.

I am planning to hit the CAT scale again Sunday to gather some new data following repositioning of weight in the rig with a focus on getting as much up front as possible. I noted in the weight info that came with the new rig (from GD) that the pin weight was 18% of the UVW of 13,342. With my motorcycle in the garage my pin weight was down to 15.4% of the GVWR. Clearly, I would like to increase that percentage to improve towing! While at the scale, I may try using the standard trailer height on the truck instead of the 1” lower alternative trailer height. I assume that would lighten the king pin weight a little bit though.

Thanks again,
Chuck

Villager Chuck, regardless of where the feet of the hitch land in the bed, it's the location of the vertical force. Looking at the pyramid, the rear 2 legs take more force from the trailer while the front 2 legs take more force from the torquing of the screw to the truck ball. The red adapter again there are 4 bolts, the 2 closest to the ball socket carry most of the tongue load, the rear ones may have some or no load and are used as part of the preloading of the king pin and help prevent the adapter from spinning.

I would bet if you turn the pyramid around in the bed you pick up load on the steering axle vs loosing load. However this will put the trailer closer to the cab.

I'm not a fan of the pyramid because any deformation in the round tubes can lead to failures.

A picture is worth a thousand words. As set up the pivot point of the trailer is at least 9" rear of the center of your truck axle, maybe more. That is also the point all the effective king pin force is too (not good) and defeats the purpose of a normal 5th wheel hitch that puts the load over or just in front of the rear truck axle. That's why 5th wheel usually are so stable towing. Its also why they don't react as fast when backing up to steering inputs.

Your set up is exactly where your sway is coming from. It 's a known issues with the Andersen they don't talk about much in the forums. Joseph Jlawles2 is correct. If you really want to keep the Andersen - flip it around to get the weight back over your truck axle. When I researched hitches a few years back I determined the Amdersen was not worth the risk to me. I was looking for a lighter hitch.

Again I am a very conservative engineer and I take my family safety seriously. When I hook up I get a bit anal making sure everything is latched. jaws closed and locked, and always do several hard pull tests. You also have the CCC to use a standard 5th wheel hitch too.

On other note - be sure you have everything torqued per Andersens specifications (you do carry a torque wrench?). I have seen several threads lately on the frame shifting and scratching the truck bed (IRV2) - which is not the real issue. Improper torquing can lead to hitch failure as it actually takes some of the stress off of the frame legs when torqued correctly. This torque should also be checked periodically during your trip.

Just trying to help.

I have the same setup on my Ram and have not experienced any sway problems. I get some chucking but no sway

Good morning Dennis66. How can you get chucking with the Andersen set up. There should be none. That's one of the good things about it and goose neck set ups. I have several goose neck trailers and both are rock solid - no chucking ever.

You must have something loose. Check the shank play into the goose neck on your truck bed. Also look for signs of the frame movement on the bed surface. Something is not right if you have chucking. By chance is you ball the incorrect size, or do you have wear in the receiver housing / coupler (orange block attached to king pin) There have been posts on the receiver wear on other sites. I believe its aluminum if I remember correctly.

As for you having no sway, every truck and trailer set up is different. Weight , axle spacing, truck suspension, etc. You must have things balanced right.

Every thing is tight and no wear, when I say chucking let me back up there is no clunking its just on certain roads you get a bit of load pull back and forth. We will feel just a pull back and forth which is just annoying. Roads in our area on the freeway from frost are not all flat so when your truck goes over then your trailer you just get that pull back and forth feel. My Anderson the aluminum ball had some play on the shaft I called Anderson and they said to use Teflon tape to take up some of the gap which I did but Im sure over time it will hammer down. I was thinking of using brass shim stock next time.

Keith and Joseph, thank you for your input. I understand how the location of the king pin weight behind the rear axle of the truck is a huge negative when towing. I will try reversing the coupler to move the pivot point forward 8” and check cab clearance to see if I can tow with that setup. (See photo added on edit) That setup would make the actual pin 1 1/2” behind the axle of the truck. It’s disappointing to me that I followed all the installation instructions from the Andersen perfectly and this is the result.

Keith - Yes, I ALWAYS use a torque wrench! I carry two with me at all times - one for the bolts on the hitch and another for the lug nuts on the rig. I check the torque values frequently to make certain everything is to spec. The frame of the hitch has never moved in the bed of truck although I also use a heavy duty rubber mat under the frame of the hitch. The rubber mat is an option offered by Andersen. I also re-torqued the bolts on the Andersen after the weight of the king pin was on the hitch.

I hope I am not overreacting to the minor sway I saw during our initial trip. I am optimistic that some load / weight redistribution in the rig to increase weight on the king pin will help and if I am successful moving the pivot point forward that will also help.




Photo with coupler reversed - king pin moved forward 8”a

Villager Chuck, reversing the coupler will add load to the bed of the truck, but that will not correct it taking load off the steering axle. The ball carrying the load is still behind the axle. I know the tag on the Andersen says to put the top ball to the rear, but look at the location of that ball in reference to the rear axle. If it's behind the axle it acts like a bumper pull and lifts the front end.

Joseph
You correct, but he has a short bed Ram - I think it is the shortest box of the the three mayor brands. My guess is this is the best he can do give his choice in hitches. Even if he put the coupler back to the original position and flipped the frame as you suggest he might not have clearance. He should re-weigh the rig and see if it helped.

Villager
Chuck what you did should help. If you still have good clearance and continue with issues try putting the coupler the way you had it and flipping the frame to ball forward. Hopefully this will at least sort out some of it.

Villager Yoda Keith, by adding load to the adapter by changing sides of the king pin he actually added load to the ball in the bed which took more load off of the steer axle.

Chuck, You need to reweigh, possibly relocate some items in the trailer and reweigh again. I don't think andersen endorses turning the bed portion of the hitch around. You would need to contact them about doing that.

Side note: if you are using click non split beam torque wrenches do not forget to release the setting as it will eventually lead to the torque wrenches loosing accuracy. Having 2 is nice, my second one (digital) has an electrical issue so I am back to my original clicker. About to pick up a 3/4 for torquing nuts on the pinbox and other things. My old clicker is a workout when I rotate tires and have to do 32 lug nuts.