Lithium + Victron + Solar Install and questions

[bellis]

bellis Yeah I would definitely reach out to them given it’sa known issue. Fair warning I had an issue with mine, the internal transfer switch was DOA, and they wouldn’t give me the time of day. All end user support has to come from the dealer you bought it from. I love their products, but that policy is their only negative in my book.

Well - I had a little better response from support. They were willing to let me send it in etc. I ended up opting to fix it myself. It was straightforward and simple enough and I didn't want to wait for shipping and repair.

I took pains to try to get the antenna's as far to the sides as possible as shown and I also kept the wires with a touch of hot glue as far from the HDMI port as possible.

Once I had it back together, plugged up etc...I tested. HDMI was in and it would not connect to wifi. I tried and retried, forgot password and re-entered. It did not work. I unplugged the HDMI and then it connected. So, I plugged the HDMI back in and it seemed to stay connected.

I replied back to support at AMSolar. Am awaiting their reply. If I have to unplug HDMI every time to connect it to wifi....that is not a real solution. It is better....but not fixed. Hopefully more to come.

[ncitro]

Well - I had a little better response from support. They were willing to let me send it in etc. I ended up opting to fix it myself. It was straightforward and simple enough and I didn't want to wait for shipping and repair.

I took pains to try to get the antenna's as far to the sides as possible as shown and I also kept the wires with a touch of hot glue as far from the HDMI port as possible.

Once I had it back together, plugged up etc...I tested. HDMI was in and it would not connect to wifi. I tried and retried, forgot password and re-entered. It did not work. I unplugged the HDMI and then it connected. So, I plugged the HDMI back in and it seemed to stay connected.

I replied back to support at AMSolar. Am awaiting their reply. If I have to unplug HDMI every time to connect it to wifi....that is not a real solution. It is better....but not fixed. Hopefully more to come.

That’s strange for sure. Would be nice if they’d offer to send you an advance replacement and then you can send them yours once you get the new one in.

[bellis]

That’s strange for sure. Would be nice if they’d offer to send you an advance replacement and then you can send them yours once you get the new one in.

They have in the past....that may have been one of the options....I just didn't want to fool with it. Will see what they kick back.

[bellis]

Lots of updates.

So, I had some stained to match leftover 1"x2" left over. As you can see pictured, I thought the cables coming out of the front were a little unprotected. I ended up drilling and screwing this small piece of stained scrap in front of the shunt to protect it from shifting cargo in the pass-through.

I went back through my previous posts and did not see where I had posted what I had ordered for solar. Back in Dec. I placed an order with continuous resources and here is what they sent. I also place several orders with Lowes for misc screws, t-channel, and other hardware.

I am intending to mount them in this fashion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UY98...index=3&t=970s

I have attached my first draft of a solar wiring diagram.

[howson]

Lots of updates.

So, I had some stained to match leftover 1"x2" left over. As you can see pictured, I thought the cables coming out of the front were a little unprotected. I ended up drilling and screwing this small piece of stained scrap in front of the shunt to protect it from shifting cargo in the pass-through.

I went back through my previous posts and did not see where I had posted what I had ordered for solar. Back in Dec. I placed an order with continuous resources and here is what they sent. I also place several orders with Lowes for misc screws, t-channel, and other hardware.

I am intending to mount them in this fashion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UY98...index=3&t=970s

I have attached my first draft of a solar wiring diagram.

The proposed fuse between the disconnect and the Combiner box, IMO, is not necessary. Why? The below is paraphrased from another source (but I think I got it right).

The solar panel array can only generate a limited (known) amount of power. Even in perfect conditions with maximum output, as long as the wire is rated for this maximum output there's no danger of the wire overheating. If you were worried about shorts, the fuse would have to be rated above the maximum output of the array…or it would blow all the time. That means even a short (maximum output of the array) …would never blow the fuse.

Example: your solar panel outputs 10A, you have to use a 15A fuse. If the short exists, 10A max will output from the panel and the 15A fuse won’t blow. If you use a 10A fuse, then the fuse will likely nuisance blow during peak solar output usage.

If you see a fuse in a grid-connected solar array schematic, that's a much larger system capable of much higher amperage than anything we put on our RVs.

Hope that makes sense.

Howard

[bellis]

The proposed fuse between the disconnect and the Combiner box, IMO, is not necessary. Why? The below is paraphrased from another source (but I think I got it right).

The solar panel array can only generate a limited (known) amount of power. Even in perfect conditions with maximum output, as long as the wire is rated for this maximum output there's no danger of the wire overheating. If you were worried about shorts, the fuse would have to be rated above the maximum output of the array…or it would blow all the time. That means even a short (maximum output of the array) …would never blow the fuse.

Example: your solar panel outputs 10A, you have to use a 15A fuse. If the short exists, 10A max will output from the panel and the 15A fuse won’t blow. If you use a 10A fuse, then the fuse will likely nuisance blow during peak solar output usage.

If you see a fuse in a grid-connected solar array schematic, that's a much larger system capable of much higher amperage than anything we put on our RVs.

Hope that makes sense.

Howard

It does. The guys over at continuous resources put that in there and were trying to sell me on a breaker box with a breaker for the before and after. They also had concerns about the Eaton Bussmann. They think it won't last due to high surge? Said that Eaton says it is not meant to be used as an on off switch and will likely blow....In my emails with them (last year - so memory maybe foggy)....the fuse was to protect the wiring on the solar panels? But, I only have one....I get that 2 AWG down to 10 AWG is a big difference....but why would power be coming from the solar charge controller to the panels?

Fuses and breakers are all about protecting wiring....but I am wondering with my config if I really should be worried about that.

howson Is this math right for those panels?

In parallel 3 sets of 2 in in series - 22.42V becomes 44.84V? So 44.84V X 28.1 amps = ~1260 watts. Am I reading the panel spec page correctly?
https://www.continuousresources.com/...panel-6-busbar

Now the fuse is a 1000V fuse....but I am not sure how many amps it would blow at....but it's higher than 15 in my math above.....

howson - would you just put a battery switch between the MPPT and the combiner box? (I have one and had originally purchased it for this purpose)....do you think this is OK without a fuse or breaker?

[howson]

Is this math right for those panels?

In parallel 3 sets of 2 in in series - 22.42V becomes 44.84V? So 44.84V X 28.1 amps = ~1260 watts. Am I reading the panel spec page correctly?

I'm "just a guy on the internet"--I do not have any special credentials, but here's my .02.

I used the Open Voltage specification (worst case scenario) when I planned my system. For your panel, that spec (VoC) is 24.9v. Since you have two panels in series, the VoC is doubled (24.9v x 2= 49.8v).

For the next math, let's assume the two panels in series are a single* 420W panel.

For current I used the IsC, or short circuit rating (again, the worst case scenario). The most amperage a single panel* in your setup could generate (IsC) is 9.85A. With three in parallel, that means 29.55A.

...but I am not sure how many amps it would blow at....but it's higher than 15 in my math above.....

A 15A fuse will blow before the panels reach their maximum output--even at the lower imp rating (9.37A). 9.37 * 3 = 28.11A. Again--why bother with a fuse that will be nothing more than a nuisance? The 10ga wire won't melt even if the panels have a dead short.

...would you just put a battery switch between the MPPT and the combiner box? (I have one and had originally purchased it for this purpose)....do you think this is OK without a fuse or breaker?

That's what I did based on the advice from AMSolar. Go to their Diagram Library at https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...C1YbLzdNrrT32E and try to find one solar setup without the switch between the panels and MPPT. (I doubt you'll find one.) Now try to find one with a fuse in the system (again, I doubt you'll find one).

Finally, they use the circuit breaker between the MPPT and battery setup. Mine has worked as intended since installation. It doesn't trip.

I'm not pitting Continuous Resources vs AMSolar, just contrasting the two and sharing my experience with a working setup.

Below is just one example from the AMSolar library (picked at random).

[bellis]

I'm "just a guy on the internet"--I do not have any special credentials, but here's my .02.

I used the Open Voltage specification (worst case scenario) when I planned my system. For your panel, that spec (VoC) is 24.9v. Since you have two panels in series, the VoC is doubled (24.9v x 2= 49.8v).

For the next math, let's assume the two panels in series are a single* 420W panel.

For current I used the IsC, or short circuit rating (again, the worst case scenario). The most amperage a single panel* in your setup could generate (IsC) is 9.85A. With three in parallel, that means 29.55A.



A 15A fuse will blow before the panels reach their maximum output--even at the lower imp rating (9.37A). 9.37 * 3 = 28.11A. Again--why bother with a fuse that will be nothing more than a nuisance? The 10ga wire won't melt even if the panels have a dead short.



That's what I did based on the advice from AMSolar. Go to their Diagram Library at https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...C1YbLzdNrrT32E and try to find one solar setup without the switch between the panels and MPPT. (I doubt you'll find one.) Now try to find one with a fuse in the system (again, I doubt you'll find one).

Finally, they use the circuit breaker between the MPPT and battery setup. Mine has worked as intended since installation. It doesn't trip.

I'm not pitting Continuous Resources vs AMSolar, just contrasting the two and sharing my experience with a working setup.

Below is just one example from the AMSolar library (picked at random).

Thanks howson. As always you are the man. Your math is roughly the same as mine above. I think I was calculating at ~90% efficiency.

[bellis]

Day 1 of Solar down. Was a good day and thank the Lord it went really well. We spent a good part of the day, but we were intentionally going slow. The adage, measure twice, cut once, and somehow still end up short comes to mind....well we looked, measured, stepped back and scratched our heads a bit and did it all again and again.

I took the advice of trying to go through the wall between the bedroom and the kitchen. I was worried I would have to tear into the wall on the bedroom side and I would never get the paneling back right or looking right. I wanted to avoid drilling down from the roof....but that didn't end up happening....we had to drill down.

We also looked at the closets in the bathroom, the entertainment center/pantry area, and the towel type closet in the bathroom. The wall between the kitchen and the bedroom will provide for probably overall the shortest runs or the 2nd shortest runs (closet would be short, but I did not want to do this).

Anyway, thanks to my dad and father in law who helped - we started by removing the trim around the skylight in the bedroom and the vent. We then removed the headboard above the door to get a better look as well as removing a kitchen drawer to look. The skylight trim removal gave access to the attic for measurements etc. There was a pipe coming up from the kitchen sink drain. It may have been at an angle and unfortunately the door frame maybe double studded of more heavily framed. Under the sink this left maybe an inch between the pipe and the wood stud. This made measuring and drilling from the top down very difficult and we had to get it right. We ended up drilling at an angle just to be safe. Instead of going completely through the wall and having to drill a new hole in the bottom floor board (another hole), there was a hole or two in the wall under the sink where the pipe went in. We were able to pull down from there and out a large hole near the fresh tank and then from there into the pass-through. We got the AMSolar combiner box mounted and extremely well sealed to the roof. I am really pleased with that product so far. I like how the bus bars are movable and how after sealing the bottom, you fill the reservoir (where the wires come up through the roof) up with sealant completely. Seems very well made; lid is sturdy and reinforced. Has a ton of screws in the top to give a consistent hold and to engage the weather seal. So, this is wired up and ready for panels to be installed and wired into the combiner box. I did not wire things up in the pass-through yet...I may have some work to do there to get it how I want. I did a little wire management under the sink and cleaned up. We also looked over the hardware and mounting of the panels with the rails.

howson or anyone - do you know of a battery switch type cover that would make it harder to simply reach and turn the switch? The MPPT always has to be turned on 1st before the solar energy is allowed to flow it or you could brick the MPPT is my understanding. So, want to maybe not put this right next to my very similar master battery switch.

Anyway - pics form today maybe aren't much...but here they are.

Maybe next week will work on the panels.

[howson]

bellis
The Victron manual does dictate battery power first, then PV applied to the controller. Removing all power to the controller is the opposite sequence.

I don't know of a cover for the PV switch. First (goofy?) thought...a strip of velcro attached to the top of the housing and overlays the switch knob. Not meant to keep someone from using the switch but seeing/feeling the velcro should trigger a pause (reminder).

[bellis]

Random note: I reached out to info@iampper.com (maker of the battery switch) to see if there was a switch lock or cover (did not see one on their site) that would give that pause moment before turning the switch. They do not have anything like that according to their reply.

[bellis]

Prior to putting the panels up (planning on doing so this coming Saturday)....what if anything should I clean the roof with? I used some 91% isopropyl alcohol to clean the bottom of the combiner box and the roof where it landed prior to sealant being generously applied.

My rig also has black lines across it that appear to coincide with pieces of wood that span the rig from side to side. OK to clean these? This is not the indication of a problem is it?

[Country Campers]

Prior to putting the panels up (planning on doing so this coming Saturday)....what if anything should I clean the roof with? I used some 91% isopropyl alcohol to clean the bottom of the combiner box and the roof where it landed prior to sealant being generously applied.

My rig also has black lines across it that appear to coincide with pieces of wood that span the rig from side to side. OK to clean these? This is not the indication of a problem is it?

All of the roofs seem to get this "black" stripe across the roof , this is right at the joint between the 2 roof sheeting wood (OSB). I do not think that anybody has come up with a reason for this , it seems to be an algae or something , not to worry as it is very common. I just use a soft brush and some dish soap to clean the roof and have not removed all of the stripe , I get tired of scrubbing. It would be best to clean the roof before adding your items and sealant to get a clean bond.

Brian

[howson]

Prior to putting the panels up (planning on doing so this coming Saturday)....what if anything should I clean the roof with? I used some 91% isopropyl alcohol to clean the bottom of the combiner box and the roof where it landed prior to sealant being generously applied.

My rig also has black lines across it that appear to coincide with pieces of wood that span the rig from side to side. OK to clean these? This is not the indication of a problem is it?

See the new RM post on this topic here: https://gdrvowners.com/forum/exterio...ing-procedures

[howson]

bellis -- I should add that I'm with Country Campers -- I don't bother trying to clean the stripes anymore, either. No one sees them and they're not harming anything.