Who sources the wet bolts? All four fail (two snap, two getting ready to)?

[BobinICT]

OK, I'm going to go out on a limb here regarding these bolt failures. Hear me out. The nuts that I see being used are not, flange nuts. They are hex nuts. How did I come to this conclusion? I'm sourcing new springs and hardware for my upcoming spring replacement. I'm using my commercial account with Dexter for my supplies. But, in looking for 9/16x8 flange nuts, none to be had. When I was at my Dexter distributor today, the guy tried and he was puzzled why there were no 9/26x8 flange nuts available. I took a flange nut from my rig, that were supplied by MORyde when I did my suspension upgrade two years ago. Not able to match.

From my aviation background, when securing something to the point there is little chance of stress movements, like in a heavy trailer, there needs to be more support other that an hex nut. Those bolts were moving in the hangers. That's a possible reason why they failed.

[ajg617]

OK, I'm going to go out on a limb here regarding these bolt failures. Hear me out. The nuts that I see being used are not, flange nuts. They are hex nuts. How did I come to this conclusion? I'm sourcing new springs and hardware for my upcoming spring replacement. I'm using my commercial account with Dexter for my supplies. But, in looking for 9/16x8 flange nuts, none to be had. When I was at my Dexter distributor today, the guy tried and he was puzzled why there were no 9/26x8 flange nuts available. I took a flange nut from my rig, that were supplied by MORyde when I did my suspension upgrade two years ago. Not able to match.

From my aviation background, when securing something to the point there is little chance of stress movements, like in a heavy trailer, there needs to be more support other that an hex nut. Those bolts were moving in the hangers. That's a possible reason why they failed.

What came off of mine were serrated flange nuts - don't know who supplied them. The replacements were MORryde wet bolts which definitely had flange nuts. Even with the serrated end on the bolt head and a serrated flange nut, the bolts still rotated enough to wear all the serrations off of the bolts.

[TedS]

Here is what I would call a proper wet bolt. A grease groove to reduce stress through the grease hole. The bolt is free to rotate requiring no knurled under the head. Orientation is not important to ensure regreasing.

[ajg617]

Here is what I would call a proper wet bolt. A grease groove to reduce stress through the grease hole. The bolt is free to rotate requiring no knurled under the head. Orientation is not important to ensure regreasing.

I think there is a broader issue here. If LCI's official position to Grand Design is that they won't honor legit warranty repairs on the frame hangers, bolts, springs because of the "terrible condition of the roads" and "people tending to overload their trailers" they are supplying chassis that aren't suitably strong enough to be used in the US. I can prove I've never overloaded the trailer (by 2500lbs) but I sure can't do anything about road conditions. Where the bolts didn't break in my case, the spring eyes were ruined. Either way, that suggests to me that the structure is designed to fail and these components are wear items which is essentially what LCI has said. Sad.

[Wileykid]

Picture of the GD mobile tech welded hanger(s) and wondering what to patch the coroplast with temporarily and what a permanent fix would be? Read the thread on the zipper pocket, but wasn't sure if that is appropriate here.

Sad to leave it like that. I would guess if Gorilla tape, or something like it sticks to the underbelly, that would be a quick temp solution until you got home.

I hope they are not trying to charge you extra for the towel.

[BobinICT]

What came off of mine were serrated flange nuts - don't know who supplied them. The replacements were MORryde wet bolts which definitely had flange nuts. Even with the serrated end on the bolt head and a serrated flange nut, the bolts still rotated enough to wear all the serrations off of the bolts.

Well now the question, were the serrated nuts self locking? If not, then that could be the problem. Serrated nuts that are not self locking have have no business in that application. I seems Dexter may have gone away with self locking flange nuts. The flange nut provides more fastener surface against the hanger and shackle bolt.

[Cate&Rob]

BobinICT

The nuts should NOT be serrated! A serrated nut will grab against the hanger and will unwind. The intent of this design is that the torque retaining ("crunch") nut tightens against the shoulder of the bolt, such that the smooth undersurface of the nut can rotate against the hanger surface with as little friction as possible. Flange nuts with a serrated under surface are for an entirely different purpose. Some hanger bolts do not have a shoulder and this will also cause problems. A crunch nut should only be used once.

See attached picture . . .

Rob

[BobinICT]

BobinICT

The nuts should NOT be serrated! A serrated nut will grab against the hanger and will unwind. The intent of this design is that the torque retaining ("crunch") nut tightens against the shoulder of the bolt, such that the smooth undersurface of the nut can rotate against the hanger surface with as little friction as possible. Flange nuts with a serrated under surface are for an entirely different purpose. Some hanger bolts do not have a shoulder and this will also cause problems. A crunch nut should only be used once.

See attached picture . . .

Rob

Rob, perhaps you misunderstood what I typed. I also stated serrated nuts should NOT be used this application. The photo you posted and your explanation drives home the fact that this problem seems to be a result of a poor fastener application. ajg617 had failure because the nuts came loose most likely. Explains why the hanger holes were elongated. Those loose shackle bolts were bouncing and moving around for some time until all gave out and failed.

Lippert makes the frame but Dexter supplies the axles, springs and other related hardware. I'm assuming the axle units are installed to the frame at the factory where the trailer is made. There seems to have been a parts change for whatever reason and locking nuts with a smooth flange apparently are no longer being used.

Edit to add, NOT

[TedS]

Serrated flanges embed to prevent unwinding when the nut is tightened. This works as long as the bolt doesn't unwind. It also depends on the initial tightening being enough to effectively embed the serrations. Tightening the nut should not squeeze the hangers tight against the spring and may not create enough preload to keep the serrations from embedding enough. Seems that a locknut, deformed or elastic, would be better to stay with the bolt.

[ajg617]

BobinICT

The nuts should NOT be serrated! A serrated nut will grab against the hanger and will unwind. The intent of this design is that the torque retaining ("crunch") nut tightens against the shoulder of the bolt, such that the smooth undersurface of the nut can rotate against the hanger surface with as little friction as possible. Flange nuts with a serrated under surface are for an entirely different purpose. Some hanger bolts do not have a shoulder and this will also cause problems. A crunch nut should only be used once.

See attached picture . . .

Rob

These are exactly what the replacement wet bolts look like. Whatever was in from the factory (and all of them were taken by the GD tech) I can't confirm except that the tech removed an intact bolt from the front left spring hanger and the bolt serrations were worn flat and a there was a significant gouge in the bolt at the shoulder of the bolt. Your picture is what was shipped to me by GD to have installed with new springs. The shackles (stamped MORryde) already had the bolts pressed in.